Kauai helicopter crash
Sep 23rd, 2005, 10:20 PM
#2
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Dusty, I've "googled" this tonight and can't find the information. Where shoud I look?
Meantime, here's an excellent summary of helicopter information for Kauai:
http://www.explorekauai.com/helicoptertours.html
Personally-- took helicopter once (Air Kauai) --never again.
Meantime, here's an excellent summary of helicopter information for Kauai:
http://www.explorekauai.com/helicoptertours.html
Personally-- took helicopter once (Air Kauai) --never again.
Sep 23rd, 2005, 10:23 PM
#3
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Sep 24th, 2005, 05:42 AM
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At least there are some survivors. The last crash three years killed everyone on board. The article left one with impression that they were flying in a pretty bad weather. I hope the survivors are not seriously hurt and recover quickly.
-Bill
Sep 24th, 2005, 08:53 AM
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So sad:
http://starbulletin.com/2005/09/24/news/index.html
We were having _horrific_ weather for flying when these 2 helicopters were up -- thunder, lightning, and torrential downpours. And these conditions had been forecast from early in the morning, so the copter company knew it was coming, and when.
HeliUSA had a perfect safety record here...until these 2 copters went down within minutes of each other.
http://starbulletin.com/2005/09/24/news/index.html
We were having _horrific_ weather for flying when these 2 helicopters were up -- thunder, lightning, and torrential downpours. And these conditions had been forecast from early in the morning, so the copter company knew it was coming, and when.
HeliUSA had a perfect safety record here...until these 2 copters went down within minutes of each other.
Sep 24th, 2005, 09:07 AM
#6
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Good friends who live in Kailua, Oahu, love hosting friends & family visiting Hawaii. The ONE thing they always advise against is the helicopter tour. Their son is a pilot for a major airline, and the father loved to fly, traveled his whole working life. They always tell us that it isn't that safe, when you look closely at the statistics. It's unforgiveable that the tours took off with that weather forecast. To each their own adventures, but I won't try it ...
Sep 24th, 2005, 09:55 AM
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bonnie: Your claim, "They always tell us that it isn't that safe, when you look closely at the statistics" is pretty incredible. I've always understood these helicopter trips are substantially safer, statistically, than driving on freeways. If you (or they) have a reference for these numbers I'd sure like to see it.
Sep 24th, 2005, 10:04 AM
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Here's another link to the crash. We're heading to Kauai in February and were considering a copter tour, but I guess we'll spend our money on something else wile we're there. Not a knock on the tours (we've been on a couple in Maui), but I'm getting too old for this -----
http://www.kauaiworld.com/articles/2...ews/news01.txt
http://www.kauaiworld.com/articles/2...ews/news01.txt
Sep 24th, 2005, 10:25 AM
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fdecarlo, no, I don't have the numbers but I trust my friend (the airline pilot) to know his stuff. On one of the TV newsmagazines (don't recall if it was 20/20 or 60 Minutes???) a few years ago, they basically said the same thing. What someone else does is their business,and I know nothing is perfectly safe ... but I'll decline this particular thrill! 
Sep 24th, 2005, 10:47 AM
#13
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Three have died as a result of the crash.
A second helo (from the same company) was forced to land in the same area an hour later due to bad weather.
The first crashed because of bad weather. A witness said he saw lightning hit the helicopter, then it went down.
Why in the world was the second one even in the air in the same area? It was on a tour and not assisting in any rescue operation of the first.
http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/ap...WS01/509240329
A second helo (from the same company) was forced to land in the same area an hour later due to bad weather.
The first crashed because of bad weather. A witness said he saw lightning hit the helicopter, then it went down.
Why in the world was the second one even in the air in the same area? It was on a tour and not assisting in any rescue operation of the first.
http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/ap...WS01/509240329
Sep 24th, 2005, 11:42 AM
#14
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Fdecarlo, here are the statistics that strongly suggest that helicopter tours in Hawaii are not safe:
Sept 24, 2005 Helicopter crash in Kauai
July 23, 2003: A Jack Harter Helicopters Bell 206B crashes at Mount Wai'ale'ale, Kaua'i, killing five.
June 15, 2003: Three tourists and a pilot are killed when a Tropical Helicopters Hughes 500 crashes in Hawai'i Volcanoes National Park on the Big Island. The cause remains under investigation.
Aug. 25, 2000: A Big Island Air Piper Chieftain plane ditches in the ocean off Hilo. The pilot and seven passengers survive, one passenger dies. The NTSB cites loss of engine power and an engine fire.
July 21, 2000: A Blue Hawaiian Tours helicopter crashes in '?ao Valley on Maui, killing seven. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into cloudy weather.
Sept. 25, 1999: A Big Island Air Piper Chieftain plane crashes on the slopes of Mauna Loa on the Big Island, killing all 10 aboard. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather, improper navigation and disregard for standard operating procedures.
June 25, 1998: A Eurocopter aircraft operated by 'Ohana Helicopters smashes into a mountainside at Mount Wai'ale'ale, Kaua'i, killing six. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.
July 14, 1994: A Papillon Helicopters Aerospatiale Astar crashes into the ocean off Kaua'i's Na Pali Coast, killing three of seven people aboard. The NTSB cites engine failure.
April 18, 1994: An Interisland Helicopters craft crashes near Hanapepe Valley on Kaua'i, killing one and injuring four. The NTSB cites engine failure.
Jan. 25, 1993: A Kainoa Aviation Hilleer 1100 helicopter plunges into the ocean off Hawai'i Volcanoes National Park on the Big Island. The pilot survives but four passengers are killed. The NTSB cites loss of tail rotor control.
Sept. 16, 1992: A Hawai'i Helicopters Aerospatiale Astar slams into the southern slope of Haleakala on Maui, killing seven. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.
April 22, 1992: All nine aboard a Scenic Air Tours Beech E18S plane die in a crash near Haleakala Crater. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.
Sept 24, 2005 Helicopter crash in Kauai
July 23, 2003: A Jack Harter Helicopters Bell 206B crashes at Mount Wai'ale'ale, Kaua'i, killing five.
June 15, 2003: Three tourists and a pilot are killed when a Tropical Helicopters Hughes 500 crashes in Hawai'i Volcanoes National Park on the Big Island. The cause remains under investigation.
Aug. 25, 2000: A Big Island Air Piper Chieftain plane ditches in the ocean off Hilo. The pilot and seven passengers survive, one passenger dies. The NTSB cites loss of engine power and an engine fire.
July 21, 2000: A Blue Hawaiian Tours helicopter crashes in '?ao Valley on Maui, killing seven. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into cloudy weather.
Sept. 25, 1999: A Big Island Air Piper Chieftain plane crashes on the slopes of Mauna Loa on the Big Island, killing all 10 aboard. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather, improper navigation and disregard for standard operating procedures.
June 25, 1998: A Eurocopter aircraft operated by 'Ohana Helicopters smashes into a mountainside at Mount Wai'ale'ale, Kaua'i, killing six. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.
July 14, 1994: A Papillon Helicopters Aerospatiale Astar crashes into the ocean off Kaua'i's Na Pali Coast, killing three of seven people aboard. The NTSB cites engine failure.
April 18, 1994: An Interisland Helicopters craft crashes near Hanapepe Valley on Kaua'i, killing one and injuring four. The NTSB cites engine failure.
Jan. 25, 1993: A Kainoa Aviation Hilleer 1100 helicopter plunges into the ocean off Hawai'i Volcanoes National Park on the Big Island. The pilot survives but four passengers are killed. The NTSB cites loss of tail rotor control.
Sept. 16, 1992: A Hawai'i Helicopters Aerospatiale Astar slams into the southern slope of Haleakala on Maui, killing seven. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.
April 22, 1992: All nine aboard a Scenic Air Tours Beech E18S plane die in a crash near Haleakala Crater. The NTSB cites pilot error for flying into bad weather.
Sep 24th, 2005, 12:11 PM
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Here is more info on this topic - an article written in 2002 which includes data demonstrating the dangers of tour helicopters.
http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/...s/02173365.htm
http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/...s/02173365.htm
Sep 24th, 2005, 12:48 PM
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dusty56438:
There are many heli-tour companies on Kaua`i, and during the day over our Na Pali coast it's like a heli-freeway with all these copters from all these companies taking folks to see the coastline.
That there were 2 copters from the same company in nearly the same airspace at the same time, is not at all unusual. Crowded, but not unusual.
My hat's off to the copter pilot who had the good sense to get out of the weather and _land_ that craft, rather than continue flying!
Rumors are rampant here on the island this morning..."the chopper was in flames before it went into the ocean", and on and on. Even our own island newspaper mis-reported that only 2 passengers had perished.
The truth will come out when the NTSB and FAA folks complete their investigations...but that can take a year or more.
There are many heli-tour companies on Kaua`i, and during the day over our Na Pali coast it's like a heli-freeway with all these copters from all these companies taking folks to see the coastline.
That there were 2 copters from the same company in nearly the same airspace at the same time, is not at all unusual. Crowded, but not unusual.
My hat's off to the copter pilot who had the good sense to get out of the weather and _land_ that craft, rather than continue flying!
Rumors are rampant here on the island this morning..."the chopper was in flames before it went into the ocean", and on and on. Even our own island newspaper mis-reported that only 2 passengers had perished.
The truth will come out when the NTSB and FAA folks complete their investigations...but that can take a year or more.
Sep 24th, 2005, 02:00 PM
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Rusty, thanks for your information. Sadly, add another recent crash to the list, from just a yr ago Septmeber 2004 when a Bali High copter crashed, killing all 5 on board:
http://starbulletin.com/2004/09/26/news/story1.html
Bill/ IAMQ--I 've no fear of high places, and have taken a heli tour of Kauai (3 weeks after a June 1998 crash--of which I was then unaware ) but I'm with your PM--I'll NEVER again go on a tourist helicopter flight ANYWHERE.
BTW, St John doesn't have helicopter island tours, so you won't feel you missed anything there On St John, there ARE decisions about wonderful boat trips--which IMHO are the more economical and safe way to have a great adventure in Kauai as well.
http://starbulletin.com/2004/09/26/news/story1.html
Bill/ IAMQ--I 've no fear of high places, and have taken a heli tour of Kauai (3 weeks after a June 1998 crash--of which I was then unaware ) but I'm with your PM--I'll NEVER again go on a tourist helicopter flight ANYWHERE.
BTW, St John doesn't have helicopter island tours, so you won't feel you missed anything there
On St John, there ARE decisions about wonderful boat trips--which IMHO are the more economical and safe way to have a great adventure in Kauai as well.
Sep 24th, 2005, 02:16 PM
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Thanks for the list, and also the article reference, which mentions a 460% increase in the number of helicopter accidents since 1996. Guess I need to update my recommended activities list.
But I have to wonder how many of these accidents are due to inherent design problems with helicopters, and how many are due to sheer stupidity on the part of tour operators and pilots.
But I have to wonder how many of these accidents are due to inherent design problems with helicopters, and how many are due to sheer stupidity on the part of tour operators and pilots.
Sep 24th, 2005, 02:17 PM
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auntiemaria
The second helicopter was forced to land in the same area an hour after the first one crashed.
The pilot of the first one had radioed a mayday and mentioned wind shear. I don't understand why a second helicopter was in the same bad weather area an hour later.
In an unrelated story, yesterday two passenger jets that had just taken off from Honolulu airport got struck by lightning and had to return (safely). One was on route to Kona, the other to Sacramento.
The second helicopter was forced to land in the same area an hour after the first one crashed.
The pilot of the first one had radioed a mayday and mentioned wind shear. I don't understand why a second helicopter was in the same bad weather area an hour later.
In an unrelated story, yesterday two passenger jets that had just taken off from Honolulu airport got struck by lightning and had to return (safely). One was on route to Kona, the other to Sacramento.
