Advice on our 10-day Germany itinerary?
Jun 20th, 2007, 06:50 PM
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Advice on our 10-day Germany itinerary?
Hello all!
We have just finished laying out our tentative itinerary for a trip to Germany this September, and wanted to pass it along for any advice you might have. (For what it is worth, it will be 2 adults, no children traveling.)
The cities are pretty much set in stone based on places and people we need to see, but if you see any glaring problems or errors in our judgement, or any piece of it seems implausible, please let us know, as it isnt too late to make some changes.
That said, we have picked a few hotels, but aren't decided on any of them... basically, we would really like any input on hotels, sights, day trips (black forest primarily) etc. in the cities we are visiting.
We are very interested in any vineyards or winemakers in these cities, and local food and customs. We are trying to find a happy medium between touristy (Neuschwanstein, Rudesheim) and non (Black Forest, Freiburg).
The itinerary is below:
::::::::::::::::
Sun 09/02/07 (day 2) - Arrive / Fuessen
- Pick up Rental Car - Munich Airport
- Drive to Fussen
Mon 09/03/07 (day 3) - Fuessen
- Neuschwanstein
Tue 09/04/07 (day 4) - Freiburg
- Drive to Freiburg
- Spend day in Freiburg
Wed 09/05/07 (day 5) - Freiburg/Black Forest
- Freiburg
- Black Forest Day Trip (Titisee?)
Thu 09/06/07 (day 6) - Baden-Baden
- Drive to Baden-Baden
- Baden-Baden
Fri 09/07/07 (day 7) - Ruedesheim
- Drive to Wiesbaden
- Drop Off Rental Car - Wiesbaden
- Bus/Train to Rudesheim
- Rudesheim
- Georg Breuer Vineyard?
Sat 09/08/07 (day 8) - Koln
- Rhein Boat Trip (Rudesheim to Koblenz)
- Train from Koblenz to Koln
- Koln
Sun 09/09/07 (day 9) - Koln
- Koln
- Kolner Dom
Mon 09/10/07 (day 10) - Depart
- Train to Dusseldorf Airport
::::::::::::::::
Thanks in advance for any input you may have!
We have just finished laying out our tentative itinerary for a trip to Germany this September, and wanted to pass it along for any advice you might have. (For what it is worth, it will be 2 adults, no children traveling.)
The cities are pretty much set in stone based on places and people we need to see, but if you see any glaring problems or errors in our judgement, or any piece of it seems implausible, please let us know, as it isnt too late to make some changes.
That said, we have picked a few hotels, but aren't decided on any of them... basically, we would really like any input on hotels, sights, day trips (black forest primarily) etc. in the cities we are visiting.
We are very interested in any vineyards or winemakers in these cities, and local food and customs. We are trying to find a happy medium between touristy (Neuschwanstein, Rudesheim) and non (Black Forest, Freiburg).
The itinerary is below:
::::::::::::::::
Sun 09/02/07 (day 2) - Arrive / Fuessen
- Pick up Rental Car - Munich Airport
- Drive to Fussen
Mon 09/03/07 (day 3) - Fuessen
- Neuschwanstein
Tue 09/04/07 (day 4) - Freiburg
- Drive to Freiburg
- Spend day in Freiburg
Wed 09/05/07 (day 5) - Freiburg/Black Forest
- Freiburg
- Black Forest Day Trip (Titisee?)
Thu 09/06/07 (day 6) - Baden-Baden
- Drive to Baden-Baden
- Baden-Baden
Fri 09/07/07 (day 7) - Ruedesheim
- Drive to Wiesbaden
- Drop Off Rental Car - Wiesbaden
- Bus/Train to Rudesheim
- Rudesheim
- Georg Breuer Vineyard?
Sat 09/08/07 (day 8) - Koln
- Rhein Boat Trip (Rudesheim to Koblenz)
- Train from Koblenz to Koln
- Koln
Sun 09/09/07 (day 9) - Koln
- Koln
- Kolner Dom
Mon 09/10/07 (day 10) - Depart
- Train to Dusseldorf Airport
::::::::::::::::
Thanks in advance for any input you may have!
Jun 21st, 2007, 01:12 AM
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All right, here's a little input about the Black Forest from an almost-local.
Titisee has become a horrible tourist trap IMHO. You'll be disappointed.
Alternatives:
1. Same road, but don't stop at Titisee, continue to Schluchsee instead, then either go up the Feldberg (the road takes you quite high up, so even if you don't hike to the summit you'll have some great views), or see the monastery in St. Blasien. Back to Freiburg via Münstertal and Staufen.
2. Or a completely different route: Take the smaller road via St. Peter and St. Märgen, then via Furtwangen to Triberg. See the waterfalls (don't forget to buy a pack of peanuts at the entrance to feed the squirrels), then follow the Gutach and Kinzig valley. Worthwhile stops: the open-air museum Vogtsbauernhof near Hausach, which is more or less a village with old houses from all over the Black Forest. The houses and farm buildings etc. are all fully furnitured so you'll see how people used to live 100 or 200 years ago. And the former imperial city of Gengenbach, small but proud, with a well preserved historical centre and a pretty baroque monastery.
Each of the two suggestions makes a full day trip, so choose one according to your interests.
On the way to Baden-Baden I'd suggest getting off the highway at Appenweier, North of Offenburg, then continuing along the Schwarzwaldhochstraße. Take the B 28 via Oberkirch, if you want somethin medieval stop in Lautenbach to see the church, then via Bad Peterstal-Griesbach. The follow the B 500 /Schwarzwaldhochstraße along its most spectacular part, high above the Rhine valley with splendid views. Stops along the way: Allerheiligen with the monastery ruins and the waterfalls, very romantic - Mummelsee, a little lake high up about which many legends are told - Bühlerhöhe if you like very posh hotels. You'll enter Baden-Baden from its prettier side via Lichtenthal.
If you have enough time in Baden-Baden, visit the spa. There are two big public ones. Friedrichsbad, the older one, is nudist, whereas at Caracallatherme, the modern one, people are expected to wear swimsuits. Knowing that may influence your choice.
Titisee has become a horrible tourist trap IMHO. You'll be disappointed.
Alternatives:
1. Same road, but don't stop at Titisee, continue to Schluchsee instead, then either go up the Feldberg (the road takes you quite high up, so even if you don't hike to the summit you'll have some great views), or see the monastery in St. Blasien. Back to Freiburg via Münstertal and Staufen.
2. Or a completely different route: Take the smaller road via St. Peter and St. Märgen, then via Furtwangen to Triberg. See the waterfalls (don't forget to buy a pack of peanuts at the entrance to feed the squirrels), then follow the Gutach and Kinzig valley. Worthwhile stops: the open-air museum Vogtsbauernhof near Hausach, which is more or less a village with old houses from all over the Black Forest. The houses and farm buildings etc. are all fully furnitured so you'll see how people used to live 100 or 200 years ago. And the former imperial city of Gengenbach, small but proud, with a well preserved historical centre and a pretty baroque monastery.
Each of the two suggestions makes a full day trip, so choose one according to your interests.
On the way to Baden-Baden I'd suggest getting off the highway at Appenweier, North of Offenburg, then continuing along the Schwarzwaldhochstraße. Take the B 28 via Oberkirch, if you want somethin medieval stop in Lautenbach to see the church, then via Bad Peterstal-Griesbach. The follow the B 500 /Schwarzwaldhochstraße along its most spectacular part, high above the Rhine valley with splendid views. Stops along the way: Allerheiligen with the monastery ruins and the waterfalls, very romantic - Mummelsee, a little lake high up about which many legends are told - Bühlerhöhe if you like very posh hotels. You'll enter Baden-Baden from its prettier side via Lichtenthal.
If you have enough time in Baden-Baden, visit the spa. There are two big public ones. Friedrichsbad, the older one, is nudist, whereas at Caracallatherme, the modern one, people are expected to wear swimsuits. Knowing that may influence your choice.
Jun 21st, 2007, 03:05 AM
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You have a long boat trip planned. It can get fairly monotonous after an hour or two, so you might consider a shorter cruise. The prettiest parts of the Rhein cruise are up to Sankt Goar. You could stop there, shop or sight see a bit, then train to Koeln.
Jun 21st, 2007, 01:04 PM
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The places you intend to see are very well connected by train. Not sure why you'd want to drive that. It will likely cost you much less to get a couple of Germanrail passes ($173 each, twinpass option, $21 each more per additional travel day) once you add gas, parking fees, etc to your rental fee. Your passage on the K-D boats would be covered by a railpass as well.
Quokka has made some good suggestions for alternatives in the BF area. Gengenbach and Staufen (both also accessible by train) are very nice. But I was in Titisee myself last year, and after 4 prior visits, I still was not disappointed. It has a lovely setting on the lake of the same name, a nice beach, and yes, things that tourists like - shops and restaurants. It is heavily visited in summer, but it just isn't "tacky" in my book in the way some places are - like Triberg, which also funnels tour buses right through the center of town (yuk). I guess we all have our personal tastes.
Freiburg is a pleasant city. If you travel by train, you might want to postpone your visit there and stop overnight in one of the Black Forest towns you'll reach on the way to Freiburg. Why? Because hosts in certain Black Forest villages - like Titisee - will give you a Konus card, a free railpass good for travel on regional trains and buses in the area during your stay and on your day of departure. The travel area is large, so on Day 6, you could use the card to travel for free from, say, Titisee, all the way north to Achern (almost to Baden-Baden; use regular tix for the few km north to B-B.)
Another suggestion: The wine and sausage festival in Bad Dürkheim from 9/7-11 and 9/14-17. It's between Baden-baden and the Ruedesheim not far from the Rhine.
"The cities are pretty much set in stone based on places and people we need to see..."
Honestly, you need more time or fewer destinations. Too much on-the-move. I don't quite get how you are going to see things or people this quickly.
I would skip Füssen if you can if you are traveling there only for Neuschwanstein and I would not fly into Munich either (although that is perhaps in stone already??) Fly into Frankfurt - do Freiburg, the BF, B-B, and the Rhine/Cologne. The Rhine boat trip, as JN suggests, is way overhyped. Best way to see castles is to walk up to them, touch them, and go inside! Spend an extra day in the area and tour Marksburg Castle in Braubach, see Bacharach, Boppard, or St. Goar, the most attractive part of the Rhine.
Quokka has made some good suggestions for alternatives in the BF area. Gengenbach and Staufen (both also accessible by train) are very nice. But I was in Titisee myself last year, and after 4 prior visits, I still was not disappointed. It has a lovely setting on the lake of the same name, a nice beach, and yes, things that tourists like - shops and restaurants. It is heavily visited in summer, but it just isn't "tacky" in my book in the way some places are - like Triberg, which also funnels tour buses right through the center of town (yuk). I guess we all have our personal tastes.
Freiburg is a pleasant city. If you travel by train, you might want to postpone your visit there and stop overnight in one of the Black Forest towns you'll reach on the way to Freiburg. Why? Because hosts in certain Black Forest villages - like Titisee - will give you a Konus card, a free railpass good for travel on regional trains and buses in the area during your stay and on your day of departure. The travel area is large, so on Day 6, you could use the card to travel for free from, say, Titisee, all the way north to Achern (almost to Baden-Baden; use regular tix for the few km north to B-B.)
Another suggestion: The wine and sausage festival in Bad Dürkheim from 9/7-11 and 9/14-17. It's between Baden-baden and the Ruedesheim not far from the Rhine.
"The cities are pretty much set in stone based on places and people we need to see..."
Honestly, you need more time or fewer destinations. Too much on-the-move. I don't quite get how you are going to see things or people this quickly.
I would skip Füssen if you can if you are traveling there only for Neuschwanstein and I would not fly into Munich either (although that is perhaps in stone already??) Fly into Frankfurt - do Freiburg, the BF, B-B, and the Rhine/Cologne. The Rhine boat trip, as JN suggests, is way overhyped. Best way to see castles is to walk up to them, touch them, and go inside! Spend an extra day in the area and tour Marksburg Castle in Braubach, see Bacharach, Boppard, or St. Goar, the most attractive part of the Rhine.
Jun 21st, 2007, 08:21 PM
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Thanks all for your input...
- QUOKKA: your suggestions for the Black Forest area are most helpful. I think we are going to give your first suggested daytrip itinerary a shot. St. Blaisen was on our list of places we wanted to check out. Thanks a ton.
- JN: thanks for the advice on shortening the boat trip...St. Goar seems like a nice place to jump off the boat (two hours on a boat seems more reasonable). That said, do you think we should skip the boat altogether and just keep the rental car for touring around that area? We could always drop it off in Koln instead. The idea was to drop it off outside Rudesheim, to allow for doing the K-D boat trip... a relaxing few hours on our trip. Should we rethink that?
-RUSS: thanks for your input on the above topics as well. As for the driving vs. train bit, we always wanted to do some driving around Germany, and this is giving us a chance to do so. I understand that in doing so, it will cost us more, but we have budgeted it into our trip planning.
Also, I understand your concern over us trying to do too much in too little time... we have had that concern as well. A few things: 1) Munich and Dusseldorf are set airport cities. 2) We really do want to see Neuschwanstein, but are willing to do some driving after our day there, instead of staying a 2nd night in Fussen, if it frees up more time for other things (it just seemed less stressful to stay another night and shove off early in the a.m.).
That said, we are having a hard time figuring out where else to cut... Baden-Baden seems like a logical cut, (as it is a single night) to save an extra day in Freiburg? or an extra day around Rudesheim? Bacharach/St. Goar area? But we were pretty excited about checking out the spa there. Decisions, Decisions!
Knowing the airports can't change, and that we really do want to see Neuschwanstein, do you have any other suggestions for narrowing our focus, what to cut, and where to spend that extra time?
Anyone else care to weigh in?
Thanks again for all your help folks!
- QUOKKA: your suggestions for the Black Forest area are most helpful. I think we are going to give your first suggested daytrip itinerary a shot. St. Blaisen was on our list of places we wanted to check out. Thanks a ton.
- JN: thanks for the advice on shortening the boat trip...St. Goar seems like a nice place to jump off the boat (two hours on a boat seems more reasonable). That said, do you think we should skip the boat altogether and just keep the rental car for touring around that area? We could always drop it off in Koln instead. The idea was to drop it off outside Rudesheim, to allow for doing the K-D boat trip... a relaxing few hours on our trip. Should we rethink that?
-RUSS: thanks for your input on the above topics as well. As for the driving vs. train bit, we always wanted to do some driving around Germany, and this is giving us a chance to do so. I understand that in doing so, it will cost us more, but we have budgeted it into our trip planning.
Also, I understand your concern over us trying to do too much in too little time... we have had that concern as well. A few things: 1) Munich and Dusseldorf are set airport cities. 2) We really do want to see Neuschwanstein, but are willing to do some driving after our day there, instead of staying a 2nd night in Fussen, if it frees up more time for other things (it just seemed less stressful to stay another night and shove off early in the a.m.).
That said, we are having a hard time figuring out where else to cut... Baden-Baden seems like a logical cut, (as it is a single night) to save an extra day in Freiburg? or an extra day around Rudesheim? Bacharach/St. Goar area? But we were pretty excited about checking out the spa there. Decisions, Decisions!
Knowing the airports can't change, and that we really do want to see Neuschwanstein, do you have any other suggestions for narrowing our focus, what to cut, and where to spend that extra time?
Anyone else care to weigh in?
Thanks again for all your help folks!
Jun 22nd, 2007, 03:43 AM
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In addition to the dom in Koln the city has many beautiful Romanesque churches. also the Romanesque cathedrals in Speyer and Worms are on your route north from Baden Baden. given your interest in wine you might want to explore some of the Deutsche Weinstrasse area SW of Worms which includes Bad Durkheim with its festival mentioned by Russ
I would vote with those who are underwhelmed by the Rhine boat trip. I think it makes sense to keep the rental car for a longer period --or certainly at least shorten the Rhine cruise
I would vote with those who are underwhelmed by the Rhine boat trip. I think it makes sense to keep the rental car for a longer period --or certainly at least shorten the Rhine cruise
Jul 21st, 2007, 04:13 PM
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Hello,
I have lived in the Black Forest for an extended period of time and I find it to be one of the most amazing places I have ever lived. First the person who has suggested Gengenbach is on the right path to really enjoy the Black Forest Expereince. You will find in some Restaurants more than 500 years of history on the walls, not to mention that the Market center is just amazing as well. It truly boasts of a rich heritage and culture as well as a broad range of food from this region. I would suggest "Steinlkellerhaus" as well as "Lowenbergkeller" as these I have found to be on the top of tradition as well as beautiful for the eyes. When you are there I suggest you stop in for a Cafe in the "Toskana bistro Cappucino" as that is a little nice cafe where you will be amazed at the mixture of cultures that are here in this little town of 7.000 just by seeing the staff and talking to them.
I say Gengenbach is a 9 on my ranking out of 10. A must see for those who want to experience life as it was, go on a Saturday and buy something from the Fresh Market on the Town Square and in the evening take the tour of the town in German, about how it used to be protected years ago.
Good Travels
Sammyj1221
I have lived in the Black Forest for an extended period of time and I find it to be one of the most amazing places I have ever lived. First the person who has suggested Gengenbach is on the right path to really enjoy the Black Forest Expereince. You will find in some Restaurants more than 500 years of history on the walls, not to mention that the Market center is just amazing as well. It truly boasts of a rich heritage and culture as well as a broad range of food from this region. I would suggest "Steinlkellerhaus" as well as "Lowenbergkeller" as these I have found to be on the top of tradition as well as beautiful for the eyes. When you are there I suggest you stop in for a Cafe in the "Toskana bistro Cappucino" as that is a little nice cafe where you will be amazed at the mixture of cultures that are here in this little town of 7.000 just by seeing the staff and talking to them.
I say Gengenbach is a 9 on my ranking out of 10. A must see for those who want to experience life as it was, go on a Saturday and buy something from the Fresh Market on the Town Square and in the evening take the tour of the town in German, about how it used to be protected years ago.
Good Travels
Sammyj1221
Jul 21st, 2007, 08:10 PM
#9
Hi,
I see nothing wrong with 2 nights in Fussen. It's especially nice "off season" as we've stayed here on 2 trips in Oct. at the Hotel zum Hechten, which is very nice. They have a free parking lot, room balconies and is right on a cobbled street in the pedestrian zone.
www.hotel-hechten.com
1 mile from Neuschwanstein is the Tegelbergbahn, which is a cable car with terrific views at the top along with an outdoor cafe/restaurant. There is also a sommerrodelbahn (luge ride) there also.
Hohenschwangau, Ludwig's boyhood home) next to Neuschwanstein is also worth the time to tour.
About 30 to 45 minutes north of Fussen is the Wieskirche, which is one of the most stunning churches we've seen in Bavaria.
www.tegelbergbahn.de
www.wieskirche.de
Hope this helps.
Oh, we love driving in Bavaria! Very easy and very scenic.
Paul
I see nothing wrong with 2 nights in Fussen. It's especially nice "off season" as we've stayed here on 2 trips in Oct. at the Hotel zum Hechten, which is very nice. They have a free parking lot, room balconies and is right on a cobbled street in the pedestrian zone.
www.hotel-hechten.com
1 mile from Neuschwanstein is the Tegelbergbahn, which is a cable car with terrific views at the top along with an outdoor cafe/restaurant. There is also a sommerrodelbahn (luge ride) there also.
Hohenschwangau, Ludwig's boyhood home) next to Neuschwanstein is also worth the time to tour.
About 30 to 45 minutes north of Fussen is the Wieskirche, which is one of the most stunning churches we've seen in Bavaria.
www.tegelbergbahn.de
www.wieskirche.de
Hope this helps.
Oh, we love driving in Bavaria! Very easy and very scenic.
Paul
Jul 23rd, 2007, 08:14 AM
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we stayed a week in meersburg, on the bodensee. what a beautiful area! majestic ferries connecting villages/cities, snow capped mountains in switzerland, paved bike paths, fascintating harbors with amazing/amusing fountains/statues. the atmosphere is happy and youthful.
Jul 23rd, 2007, 06:59 PM
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I agree with Willes, The Bodensee (Lake Constance) area is beautiful and not as touristy as the Black Forest. When driving North, do not miss the Deutsche Weinstrasse (German Wineroad) in the Pfalz (Palatinate), it is called Germany's Tuscany. There are a lot of Wine Festivals in September. Enjoy!
Jul 23rd, 2007, 07:26 PM
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Gengenbach in the Black Forest is a lovely little town and not at all "touristy". Can't speak for any of the other places in the BF because Baden Baden was the only other town we visited and then we couldn't wait to get out and back to Gengenbach!
