itsv

Hello everyone, it's the mom of the 13yr. old son who went to China for 17 days as a Student Ambassador in the People to People International program. My son got back yesterday and wow, I received a confident, mature, happy and a little bit skinner (he could use the lost) son back from the trip. I want to thank everyone here on the board who helped me with the planning and answering my many questions. I truly appreciate your help and time. I promised I would report back to you on his trip so here it goes:

The Good: My son called twice from China and both times he reported he was having a great time. He went to Beijing, overnite train to Xian, Hongdan Village, flew to Shaghai, bus to Suzhou and flew to Hong Kong. He really enjoyed the trip and saw many interesting things along the way and had many different experiences. The way the trip is set up is that they tour a bit, attend classes on various Chinese cultural things (sorry can't think of a better word), stay with a host family and attend a Chinese school. The days were packed, tours of the Great Wall, Forbidden City, Summer Palace were some of the things he did in Beijing. He also attended a Chinese cooking class, saw a martial arts demonstration, acrobatic show and the Chinese Opera. In Xian he saw the terracota warrior, toured the wall and Goose pagoda. In the village, he stayed with a very nice host family (mom, dad and newphew the same age as my son). The family were farmers so the kids picked peaches. The family let off fireworks since it was the 4th of July. Shaghai was his favorite city, he liked the tall buildings and Jade Buddha that they saw. He didn't like Shouzhou as much because he said he didn't see the big deal about the gardens (typical for a 13 yr. old boy). I haven't heard much about Hong Kong because my son is pretty jet lag and things are just coming out in bits and pieces.

I sent my son with close to $1100 (everything was paid for, he just needed spending money) and I know I went overboard but was just trying to make sure I covered all bases. He had a Visa Buxx card (highly recommend it), regular ATM, travelers' checks, cash (both Chinese and American). Well he gets the frugal traveler award because he only spent $373 on the trip and came home with the rest. He told me he doesn't really like shopping on trips and enjoys seeing things more. He said other kids both a lot of junk and he only bought what he really wanted. Thanks for the suggestions on the "chops" he came home with one for him and his sister. Other purchases were decorated chopsticks, silk robes, little terracota warriors, an engraved plaque saying "I climed the great wall" purses for me and his grandmother and a very pretty necklace for me. He also bought calligraphy which spelled out that he "loved us." (I know that one drove me to tears). He said they went to places where bargaining was not permitted. He was dissapointed because he never found the cheap dvds (he was looking for star wars).

Other classes he attended were caligraphy, paper cutting, pingpong. The kids had two basketball games against the Chinese students. and he reported that his group was the first ones to defeat the Chinese (they had really tall kids in the group and my son plays a lot of basketball).

Some of you might remember my panic "malaria postings." Well my son said that mosquitos were not really that big of a deal. What is also funny is that my son was not sick once yet when I unpacked his suits case practically all of the wipees, handsanitizers etc. were still full in their containers. So much for motherly advice.

My son says he is glad he went on the trip and worked so hard for it. (Remember he sold $1000 candy bars to pay for his share which we required). He found China very exotic and at times difficult. He always seemed excited about what he saw and the pictures always show him smiling (a good sign). He said he was only a little bit homesick and just twice wished he could come home. He loved the overnight train trip to Xian.

I am extremely proud of my son because he learned independence as far as packing for himself and looking after himself, handling his own spending money, and the experience of getting along with different people. I was shocked to find that he didn't lose a single thing on the trip. I believe the trip gave him self-confidence in himself.

Thank you all for your help,
Itsv

itsv

Now for the Bad: Let me preface my comments with how the program works: students are nominated, they get interviewed, have to get recommendations from teachers and attend 6 months of monthly orientation meetings. So you figure you really know these kids and know they will act like mature ambassadors representing the U.S. in China WRONG !! My best title would be "the Girls Gone Wild Franchise Hits China." The behaviour of some of the kids in the delegation was horrible and really affected the whole trip. Fortunately for me, it appears that my son was the least affected. He and a very good friend he made in the process said there were about 5 kids out of 40 who were really interested in learning about China and the rest just wanted to party, get away from the parents and shop till they drop with their parents's money. My son and his friend smartly decided that they would stay to themselves, obey the delegation leaders and pretend they were on a trip with just themselves. The stradegy worked because they both had a great time.

I'll share with you the other students' antics because you won't believe them. Now the group is 12, 13 and 14 yr. kids from California (mainly orange county) (we live in san Diego and were one of only 2 kids from S.D.) Some girls broke the 10:30 p.m. curfew and sneaked out of the hotel. There were other reports of breaking curfew. Girls stood in the hallway of the hotel in Beijing and screamed all night distrubing other guests and thinking they were funny. Some kids sent their hotel rooms on fire and in the words of P2P "tore apart the hotel." Apparently the delegation was so bad that they got kicked out of two hotels (the hotel I know in Beijing has not invited P2P back after having a 7 year history of them staying at this hotel) (other delegations leaving the U.S. have had to make new hotel arrangements) 3 girls brought suitcases filled only with inappropriate clothing (super short shorts, spaghetti straps-things they were warned about). Some kids decided their time was better spent making out with each other (in clear violation of the rules. Some kids also did things which were construed in Chinese culture as insults such as putting thier feet up on tables, groping each other etc. Girls did something with drunk hotel guests and then when these guests offered them beer, they tried to claim that they were innocent etc. When a group of girls were told to me quiet on the bus, they talked back to the leader. Other kids in public places would brag in loud voices about how much "richer they were than the Chinese people." Can you say ugly american? There were other incidents but i can't recall them right now because I am so mad.

My son and his friend said there were some kids who all they wanted to do was shop and would complain when they had to see cultural things.

Things were so bad that they had to have a nationwide conference call here in the U.S. with the delegation leaders for future trips to China. Moreover I heard from other groups that our group was used as an example as how now to behave.

So you would think most parents would be appalled at such behavior, no instead the parents sent emails severely criticizing the leaders because the leaders were being "mean" .

I'll post more later, I have to run. I have a few more things I have to get off my chest and I need some advice.
Thanks, itsv

massagediva

itsv-
I read the "good" part and I thought there couldn't really be too much "bad" as it sounded like your son had a truly wonderful experience.Those children sound horrid and I hope there are some consequences for their behavior.It sounds like you have a lovely son,you should be proud of him.

jvrab12

itsv-I am a leader with People to People and just got back from my trip to Europe. Your son is so lucky to have been in a delegation traveling to Asia. In Michigan-only a "select" group of students are invited on the Asian trips and they travel with the Area Director.

I don't have time right now to read your entire post but I will later on tonight and I do another post.

Guenmai

Times have really changed I see. One of my best friends and a whole group of other friends went on the summer program...to Europe...in 1973. I went separately to Europe that summer. Their trip was great and had no behaviorial problems like the above. They were really screened back then. It doesn't surprise me that the parents would blame the organization for their kids' out of control behavior...the apple doesn't fall far from the tree...I see such kid and parent behavior a lot these days! Happy Travels!

BigJim

Glad to hear your son had a good time. But as I was reading your post, I knew what you were going to say as far as the "bad" part of the trip. It's sad to say, but what can you expect when you put a bunch of teenagers together???

jules39

Congrats on raising a great son. You should be proud!
j

itsv

Thank you all for your compliments. I find myself as a parent hoping I am doing the right thing with my children. My son made me incredibly proud and I know he got some grief for not joining in some of the antics. That's not to say he is a saint, but like other kids in does have moments of 13 yr. old behavior but I trust in knows how to act in public both when i am with him and when I am not.

In my previous post I meant to say "how not to behave" instead of "how now to behave." Sorry.

Massagediva: I too hope there will be consequences to the behavior, but I doubt it based on the reaction of the parents of the offenders. Their response was to send scathing emails about the leaders and how the leaders were mean, rude etc. Parents were called form China about their children's behavior. Plus P2P does have a zero tolerance policy (e.g. you get sent home at your parent's expense) for some of the things that occurred. If I had gotten a call about my son sneaking out of the hotel and breaking curfew, I would have said "send him home." If he was doing anything else wrong, I would have called the leader again the next day and if it continued it would have been sent home. In addition, both he and i would have sent apologies to everyone.

Traveling is a priviledge not a right and with kids I have found that all you need to do is show you mean business. Too many times these days I find parents are trying to be their kids 'friends" rather than parents. This does not mean I run a prison with my kids or that we are not close, indeed I take a trip each year with one kid and they get to pick the location. My kids know that their are certain expectations for all of us (parents and kids) and that to be a good human being in this world you must live by those standards.

I think another thing for trips like this is if you just sent a check in for payment or if you made you child contribute part of their money for the trip. My son sold $1000 candy bars to pay for some of his tuition and spending money. His best friend on the trip saved all year Xmas and birthday money and raised $1200. Both boys behaved, received no warnings and received a pass grade. We could have just written a check but wanted him to have pride in accomplishing his goal-plus it got people in our community interested in his trip-everyone bought candy. As my son said, he wasn't "going to blow this trip because he had worked too hard to get their."

JVRAB12: My son does consider himself lucky to travel to Asia-our local delegation was going to France and Italy (where he has already been) so he asked if he could join the O.C. delegation and go to China. I don't think we have the same "selection process" for our China trip as you do, but I think it is a good idea. Our kids did travel with "repeat" delegation leaders.

Big Jim: I disagree with you about this should be expected behavior when you get a group of teenagers together. P2P has delegations go all over the world and the kids in that group do not acted that way. Indeed, I know of a delegate from Texas who went two weeks prior to my son's trip and nothing of that nature occurred on their trip.

thanks, itsv

itsv

The Bad contd." Okay so I need some advice. When I was trying to reach my son in China at his hotel, the hotel connected me to what was his room, but instead i got two girls in the delegation. When i asked for my son, one of the girls explained that my son had traded rooms with them to get away from drunk hotel guests across from their room. The other girl became very rude and i could hear her shouting things such as: "hang up on her, tell her to not bother us, tell her we don't care where her son is." It turns out that this girl was the biggest trouble-maker on the trip. In addition, her mother was the biggest emailer on the trip about how mean and rude the leaders were. I am tempted to email this mom, telling her about her daugher's behaviour with me and asking for an apology on behalf of the entire delegation. Should I do it? Will it do any good?

I don't live near these people and I will only see them at the wrap-up meeting in Sept. Or should I just forget about it?

Thanks for your help,
Itsv

Corgie

Wow! What result are you hoping for by doing this? I would not ask for any type of apology as any demand made on your part will likely get the mother on the defence. Rather, if you feel you must do this, maybe approach it as "one concerned parent to another". While making the contact, don't paint your son as the good guy, but rather express your dismay at the fact that you have learned that there have been some behaviors that were unacceptable and that you certainly will be having a talk with your son about what happened on this trip (in a way you already have). AND then mention what you experienced personally. Situations like these must be dealt with in a very delicate manner. I would also suggest you take a few days to let the outrage you rightly are feeling to wear off a bit before sending any type of email off.

easytraveler

My first thought is that, if this girl is as bad as you have stated, then she has already lied to her mother to get her mother on her side.

If you complain about her, she'll lie again and paint your son black.

Let it go. Don't talk to the mother; if you must, talk to the P2P people.

Congratulations on raising such a fine son!

BigJim

I too, totally commend you for raising a fine son. I agree that not all teens act out of control, but more often than not, it does happen, especially when you put them all together and send them off somewhere. They somehow feel they should or that they have some obligation to party and act like a bunch of morons! Hey, they're away from home and away from their parents, it's time to let loose! And I'm sure you've been "told" that this hasn't happened in previous P2P trips, but who's to say it hasn't?? Teens are VERY good at hiding/keeping things from their parents, and I'm sure they could do the same with the P2P people. And please don't take this the wrong way, but who's to say that your son was really the "good boy" that he was on this trip just because that's what he "told" you?? And just because the P2P people didn't see certain kids doing anything, doesn't mean they weren't just as bad, perhaps doing other things.

But again, if such was not the case with your son, then I do commend him and you.

BigJim

I forgot....but I totally agree with your statement about too many parents wanting to be "friends" with their kids.

Poohgirl

itsv: Your son sounds like a great young man. Good job, both of you.
As to contacting the little monster-teen's mother, I'd have to say why bother? When the committee informed her about her brat's behavior, she blamed them. She will most likely be just as bad if not worse with you. She just doesn't get it. No need to deal with that fall-out. Just comfort yourself that when the brat turns 16 or 17, Mommy's lack of parenting skills will come back to haunt her.

LynnieD

Ok, my kid is a total brat and I am from O.C. Kids here are overindulged, spoiled and pretty wild. My now 15 year old tells me he was making out with girls from church group in 7th grade!!!

I would never dream of sending my child on this kind of trip although he is widely travelled with his father and I. I know how much trouble he could get into left even moderatly unsupervised and would not want to make anyone responsible.

It is very difficult (I know from experience) to cop to your childs badside. Having said that, I would send a concerned email to the mother involved. She may take serious offense, but who cares? You don't live next door to this woman. On the other hand, it may be what she needs to come out of the ether in regards to her little darling. I would not demand an apology or anything else from her. Just a sincere email giving her a heads up on her daughters interaction with an adult.

Some of us do get the message and attempt to correct the years of bad parenting and permissivness we've gotten caught up in society.

Good Luck

Neil_Oz

"...but what can you expect when you put a bunch of teenagers together???" Better than that, I would hope, if they haven't been raised as nasty, spoilt, selfish brats. I was under no illusions about my daughter or any of her friends when they participated in a brief exchange program with a school in San Diego, but we were pleased to find that they'd behaved themselves, and we heard no complaints. Same situation in the other direction, too, actually.

I too fear that these shallow and indulgent parents, and their unpleasant offspring, will pay a price for their weaknesses in future years.

Neil_Oz

Re-reading my last post I realised that it probably came across as horribly smug. Sorry. For the record, we made all the usual mistakes plus a few more. Raising kids is a hard job, and there's no guaranteed path to success. Having said that, the behavioural standards described by itsv do sound particularly low.

Guenmai

As far as the bad behavior of this girl and her mother. Her mother knows how badly the girl acts...why do you think she wrote the check to send her away on a trip? It's a VERY unfortunate situation though and there's always someone who has to try to ruin it for everyone else. I know I would say something to the mother...that's just my personality. I think that by folks just smiling and letting things go... it just makes things worse...I see A LOT of that these days. Someone needs to speak up if they are upset about a situation. Happy Travels!

climber

itsy,
Do you have any advice of what forms etc we need/should have completed to send with a "gaurdian" for our kids?

We are sending our kids to Tokyo and Beijing with their team coach and are looking for what forms etc we need to have completed so there are no problems with the trip.

nypintha

You seem like a great mom and like you have a great son. I love your idea of making him work for the trip. I'm taking notes for when I have kids! Too bad the other kids were so out of control.

When I went to Europe with my high school in the early 90s, I remember that we probably weren't the most sensitive group and preferred shopping over visiting yet another castle. However, the fact that our high school was combined with a Mormon high school was a good thing. We didn't do any underage drinking or sneaking out. Ironically, my best friend from high school was not able to join our trip due to the fact she was a counselor at "Bible Camp" that week. She ended up with a completely wild bunch of teens. It was just sad that her trip was ruined by people like that.