Patty

We will be leaving very soon for Hong Kong and I have been trying to find the best places to shop and where to stay away from. We are staying at the Kowllon hotel in Tsim Sha Tsui area on Nathan Road. I have read many pros and cons about shopping on Nathan Road. Some say it's a great place to shop, while others say you have to be very careful shopping there, some really bad deals. I'm all ears to any advice on the subject. Patty

Bart

Hi Patty,<BR><BR>It depends on what you are buying and how long you are staying. Hong Kong is still a shopper's paradise if only for looking. Your hotel should have free guidebooks, complete with maps, to start you on the right track. If these are unavailable at the hotel, get copies through one of the Hong Kong Tourist Association offices. Someone from HKTA may actually be distributing info packages after you exit airport customs. <BR><BR>Besides clothing, Nathan Road has more jewelry, cameras and electronics in several blocks than almost any other area in Hong Kong. These items are usually priced lower elsewhere (such as the Central District on Hong Kong Island). Tsim Sha Tsui retailers know that you tourists are a captive market. That doesn't mean you can't get a good deal if you bargain hard. The economy isn't what it used to be, and storeowners are anxious to move their goods.<BR><BR>Resist the urge to buy at the first place you see an item no matter how good a deal it seems – it helps to shop around in several places! Use Nathan Road to window shop on the pricey items. Look around for the best deal on Hong Kong Island or even north of Tsim Sha Tsui (still on or near Nathan). You can always return to Tsim Sha Tsui later in the evening to buy those scarce items you can't find elsewhere.<BR><BR>Bargains in clothing may be found in some of the streets branching off Nathan - try the stores on Granville, Cameron, and Mody Roads which sell brand name odds-and ends and which self-style themselves as "factory outlets". On Hong Kong Island, you should shop around Stanley Market on the south end of HK Island, though bargains aren't what they used to be. Jardine's Bazaar in Causeway Bay and the strip bordered by Connaught Road and Des Voeux Road in Central are other shopping areas on the Island. I'm going strictly by memory, so double check against a guidebook. <BR><BR>If shopping for cheap knickknacks, "throw-away" clothing and accessories, try the Ladies Market in Mong Kok or Temple Street Night Market - both are open late at night and accessible from the MTR stations. <BR><BR>If buying cameras or electronic equipment, be careful you don't get the original item switched for a cheaper one or a used one. Returned goods sometimes have the boxes repacked in plastic wrapping to make them seem like new. What seems like a real bargain may not really be, or it may not be compatible with your electrical outlets back home - so caveat emptor. <BR><BR>Designer clothing is just as pricey as back home unless you are buying the knockoffs. Designer sales happen once or twice a year - your hotel concierge might know of any upcoming sales. Check out the higher end clothing in the mega-malls - Pacific Place is great to browse especially if you are seeking refuge from the heat. You are visiting HK during the hottest part of the year. <BR><BR>As I mentioned in another post, before leaving home buy or borrow the book by Suzy Gershman called "Born to Shop: Hong Kong Shanghai and Beijing".<BR><BR>Regards,<BR>Bart

jean

I had a very bad experience shopping for electronics in Nathan Road. Watch out for the ff tricks:<BR>1) Salesman will tell you the specific item you are looking for is "old stock" and discontinued. I had a specific video camera model in mind which was the latest acdg to the magazine.<BR>2) Salesman will say they don't have it at the moment but will get it in the warehouse. He will ask for a deposit to make sure you buy it.<BR>3) If you do decide to buy the product he is giving a demo on, make sure it is the same product and that it is not switched with a cheaper more inferior product.<BR>I was a victim of these dishonest Chinese salesmen. I paid $800 for a supposedly top of the line video camera; found out when I got home it was only worth $200! It was the most basic camera in the market. He pulled all of the above 3 stunts with me. I cannot remember the name--something like "Fair Camera" or "Fair Electronics". But be warned. The store was along Nathan Rd., in b/w the Holiday Inn Golden Mile and the Sheraton. I tried contacting them but they would not return my money.<BR>

Dave

I can't tell you about shopping particulars, but the stores on HK island, especially Central district, looked better to me. It is easy to get to HK island by the star ferry - which is incredibly cheap, about 25 cents, as I remember.

Bart

Some other tips:<BR><BR>1. For cheap items, don't worry if you paid a little too much - most of the fun is in the bargaining. Ask for a discount even if it is for one item, then ask what the price is for several and you will probably get a discount.<BR><BR>2. Expensive Swiss watches are always discounted at least 25% from retail, with 35% to 50% as the target price you should aim for. Be careful of fakes, especially Rolexes which can have "authentic" hologram identification stickers on the caseback, and can fool even an experienced watchmaker. Used Rolexes can have the entire movement inside swapped with a $10 replacement. If you want to buy, go to reputable stores on HK Island with the HKTA symbol and always comparison shop at several stores.<BR><BR>3. Don't buy expensive jade objects. A lot of the stuff at places like the Jade Market in Kowloon is either overpriced or is fake. Again, it takes an expert to identify and appraise jade. Dark green jade jewellery is often dyed to make it look expensive. The same goes for "antiques" which can be faked complete with identifcation papers.<BR><BR>4. Don't tell the salesmen you are just visiting or "will be leaving tomorrow", or the discounts will not be as good especially on expensive items. Or tell them you are visiting a friend or relative and that they will shop around for you before you buy. Even though there are still lots of expatriates working in HK, the locals will spot you for a tourist without you uttering a word.<BR><BR>5. If you walk away after offering a "lowball" price and the dealer runs after you, it means he is willing to bargain more.<BR><BR>6. After negotiating a price, make sure you can get the same discount with a credit card. Often the vendor will tack on another 5% if you don't pay cash. In hard times, this discount is "waived".<BR><BR>7. Use banks to exchange cash or travellers checks to get the best exchange rate. Banks are closed Sundays. There is sometimes a flat rate so you may want to exchange larger amounts at one time. Keep a little extra cash in your hotel safe (some rooms have these). Be careful of pickpockets everywhere you go.

Patty Feerst

Thanks for all the super replys. You've been a great help. It sounds like I need to window shop on Nathan road and get an idea of prices, but the best deals are on Hong Kong Island. I hear you can get some great deals on clothing, but I wonder about the sizing. Even though I'm a size 8, people say I,m big compared to the Chinese women. Is there a sizing problem? (this is something only the ladies can answer)Is it safe to shop at night or shoud I try to find something else better to do?

Bart

Hi Patty,<BR><BR>The horror stories you hear about Nathan come from tourists who have been an easy target for ripoffs in cameras and electronic gadgets. On the other hand Nathan clothing stores, while not having the lowest prices, should be reputable especially if they are part of a large chain.<BR> <BR>Although smaller sizes are more common, you shouldn't worry about finding your size. Many expatriate women are taller than Chinese locals, and they have to shop somwhere. The name brands (Hilfiger, LL Bean, Nautica, Polo to name a few) sold as clearance in the factory outlets are made for the North American market - you should find men's and ladies sizes that simply won't fit most Chinese. Unfortunately some name brands have their inner labels cut off.<BR><BR>Last time I forgot to mention that there are (used to be?) factory oulet stores in the Hung Hom district, northeast of the Kowloon Hotel and accessible by taxi. I don't know if the stores are still there - you need to ask when in HK.<BR><BR>Tailored clothing is another option if you want an exact fit. I would stay away from the small shops in Tsimshatsui - not necessarily because they might cheat you - but because quality of workmanship or fabric isn't that great. For some of the best quality in men's and ladies tailoring, there is W.W. Chan & Sons on Nathan in Tsimshatsui and Ascot Chang for shirts. Both are close to your hotel; I think the latter is in ground floor of the Peninsula Hotel. These places are very pricey. There are many tailor shops on HK Island that sell acceptable quality for less. For instance, there's Pacific Custom Tailors at 322 Pacific Place (take the MTR from Tsimshatsui to Admiralty station, which is beneath the Pacific Place shopping mall). Even if you don't buy, check out the hanging pictures of actors Pierce Brosnan and Jane Seymour, author James Clavell, former Australian Prime Minister Bob Hawke, and Bill Clinton! The Admiralty Centre in the adjoining mall has a couple more tailor shops.<BR><BR>As for night shopping, you should know that Central stores close early but some Tsimshatsui stores stay open till 10 or even 11 pm every night. The neighborhood around your hotel is quite safe and the police are everywhere. Ladies Night Market and Temple Street are also safe at night. In general, it's okay even for a single person as long as you stick to areas with crowds. Stay away from secluded areas with no traffic. Keep a tight grip on your purse and be wary of pickpockets and thieves even in broad daylight.<BR><BR>If you get tired of night shopping, check out the bars and nightspots in the Wanchai district on HK Island. I'm not a bar-hopper so you'll have to refer to Fodor's or Lonely Planet guidebooks.<BR><BR>Despite all the above cautions, I would still rate Hong Kong one of the safest cities in the world - surpassed only, in my opinion, by Tokyo and Oslo.<BR><BR>Regards,<BR>Bart

Patty

Thanks Bart for your thoughtful input. I'm not a bar hopper either, but I'll check out Lonely Planet and Fodors.

john

Bart, I am also going to Hong Kong in a couple of months and I'm interested in a mid priced tailor for suits. Have you ever shopped at these tailors for suits in Hong Kong that you mentioned? Any ideas on pricing? I know it usually depends on fabrics, but just do not want to spend the $800-$1000 in some of the big hotels mentioned in Kowloon. Thanks for any help you can provide.

The artist formerly known as...

Hi John,<BR><BR>I have tried posting my reply on several occasions, but Fodors keeps rejecting me. So this message is broken up into two posts.<BR><BR>Between 1996 and 2001, after my home tailor retired, I've had five suits made. One was from Kwun Kee Tailors in Admiralty Centre and four from Pacific Custom Tailors in the Pacific Place shopping centre. I've also had six shirts made at PCT. Kwun Kee was a bad choice. They undersized the waist of the trousers even after measuring me carefully, the jacket had a pucker below the neck, and the bottom of the jacket wasn't straight. To make matters worse, the suit wasn't ready on the promised date and I had to make two more trips back to HK before resolving the problems (a friend arriving from HK ended up delivering the jacket). I mention Kwun Kee as an example of what can go wrong with budget tailors. I am sure others have had better experiences with some of their other shops which are all over HK). On the other hand, Pacific Custom Tailors has always been responsive to my wishes and they deliver on time as promised.<BR><BR>Pacific doesn't do top quality like my old tailor, but the prices are right and you can even negotiate a discount with two suits. They can do a 3-day turnaround on a suit. I suggest you get measured up as soon as you arrive in Hong Kong and allow at least a week turnaround so the tailor isn't rushed. This applies no matter whom you choose as the tailor. You will need to go back for 2 or 3 fittings to get a decent fit, which they can’t do in a short turnaround and which they won’t tell you if you are in a hurry. If anything needs further alteration, simply insist on having it done and wait.<BR><BR>I went to W.W. Chan & Sons only to check on their prices and quality. I would suggest you go there to compare against those charging less. From what I remember, they guarantee the suits "for life" and will do free alterations whenever you come to HK (don't hold me to this though). Having inspected some of their work, I can say their quality is above average. I almost ordered suits on two occasions, but decided against it due to the shortness of my stay. W. W. Chan requires about 8 or 9 days with you returning for 3 or even 4 fittings. Nowadays, I use an excellent tailor back home for my best suits, and I get my "budget" everyday suits in HK. <BR><BR>(continued in next post)

The artist formerly know as...

Here are some tips you may find useful:<BR><BR>1. Bring along fabric swatches as samples to show the tailor in HK. Pacific Custom Tailors has actually mailed fabric samples to my home after I described the type of fabric and color on the phone.<BR><BR>2. Get some men's fashion magazines and cut out some designs to take with you. Tailors in HK can do a good job at copying almost any style.<BR><BR>3. Do your homework on the different types of fabrics so you can quickly decide what you want when you visit the tailor. For instances, dress shirts should be 100% cotton, never a polyester/cotton blend which makes them sticky in summer. Sea Island cotton is the best quality, and is superior to the better-known Egyptian cotton. Of course, Sea Island is scarce and despite ordering it you may be unknowingly receiving a cheap substitute.<BR><BR>4. For suits, the best fabric is 100% pure wool with the choice of weight depending on your climate back home. A good quality gabardine wool wears very well and will resist tearing. Flannels will show shiny spots after wearing unevenly (especially at the seat of the pants). Personally, I find some of the mink cashmere wools wear well and have sufficient texture so as not to show shiny wear spots.<BR><BR>5. With some tailors, you can negotiate even on the advertised sale price. At the moment, business is awfully slow in HK and most tailors will accept any reasonable offer. I would offer 10-15% less than the "sale" price and see what happens. Tell them you are shopping around.<BR><BR>6. The sale items invariably use the cheapest grade fabric. I have often gotten a better grade of wool for suits or cotton for shirts without paying extra after first negotiating the price.<BR><BR>7. Suits will typically range from $3000-$10000 HK (around $384-1282 US). That's usually with 2 pairs of trousers and you might be able to negotiate a vest as well. Don’t go to the tailors which charge less or you may be sorry.<BR><BR>8. You will not get the best imported English or Italian wools with the cheaper tailors. Even Pacific Custom Tailors doesn't use the best wool. I believe a lot of the wool in HK comes from mainland China. On the other hand, W.W. Chan does use top quality British wool, and so does another shop in Admiralty whose name I forget. That's a reason why their prices will be higher than other shops.<BR><BR>9. Some stores will not charge extra premium when you pay by credit card. Others may ask for cash, or their "best price" will be bumped up by 5% if you pay by credit. <BR><BR>In summary, stay away from the cheapest shops, be wary even when dealing in the mid-range stores, and negotiate an additional discount whenever you can.<BR><BR>Regards,<BR>The artist formerly known as Bart<BR>

john

John, thanks for the detailed info. Will definitely visit Pacific Custom Tailors, although my time will be short in HK. Do you think I can still get a quality suit there in 6 days?

Bart

John,<BR><BR>PCT can definitely do a suit in 6 days. The first time, I had 2 suits delivered in 3 days. I noticed, however, that the workmanship was not as good as back home. I got 2 pairs of trousers with each suit and the grand total came to $7200 HK, or less than $1000 US (and no sales tax). <BR><BR>Last September, I got 2 suits with better quality fabric for even less. The workmanship was better this time partly because I didn't rush things. I went to mainland China for 10 days, came back for another fitting and picked up the suits two days before I left HK. So I think 6 days is enough if you start immediately after you arrive in HK with the measurements and selection of fabric. You can work out the details of certain things later. Be sure you ask for these additions to get your money's worth: heel and toe protectors on the inside pant cuff, watch pocket in the trousers, two inside jacket pockets and pen pocket, full or half lining inside trouser legs, choice of color on inside jacket lining, buttons for suspenders, etc.<BR><BR>Regards,<BR>Bart