Driving through Europe.
Jul 29th, 2012, 04:13 PM
#22
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Part of the advice I gave you was because I lived in Germany and did drive in winter. DH is from NY, and I am from a very Northern state, so we grew up driving in the US in winter. Winter in some places in Europe can be as bad as anywhere in US. The worst snow storm I've ever been in was on a not very long drive from Amsterdam to Frankfurt. Won't go into all the details, but it was a nightmare. If, as you even said, it is risky, you are free to put yourself in that situation, but why would you put anyone that you care about at risk?
Others who have given you advice have also lived in Europe, some for many years, so they have driven there in winter, just not doing long tours as you intend.
Winter is beautiful in many places in Europe, just not "fun" driving as you might think, and really, really not "fun" for the passengers biting their nails while driving on ice or through a snow storm.
If you can pick a few absolutely beautiful places, not too far apart, stay in one place and keep a check on the weather before you head out to the next place, staying flexible, you could have a decent trip and still be friends with your girl at the end.
If you do this, plan ahead for places to stop in emergencies. Also, be sure to know the laws of each country for driving in various conditions. I honestly do not know this, but I am sure another poster will. I recall somewhere that if you are involved in an accident or stopped because of road conditions, snow tires or chains may be required in some areas. As we had our own car, I don't know how that works with a rental car.
My last advice is for traveling with your girl. Have you informed her fully as to what the trip might be like? You don't want her to feel trapped in the car after a couple of days. Some people can spend hours in a car - others two or three. If she starts to feel trapped, you might want to have a back up plan for more exploring, walking, cafe, museum time or a plan for ditching the car and going someplace fun and warm. If you really like her (and I guess you do if you want to spend a month with her in Europe), be considerate of her needs, wants and welfare even more than your own.
Others who have given you advice have also lived in Europe, some for many years, so they have driven there in winter, just not doing long tours as you intend.
Winter is beautiful in many places in Europe, just not "fun" driving as you might think, and really, really not "fun" for the passengers biting their nails while driving on ice or through a snow storm.
If you can pick a few absolutely beautiful places, not too far apart, stay in one place and keep a check on the weather before you head out to the next place, staying flexible, you could have a decent trip and still be friends with your girl at the end.
If you do this, plan ahead for places to stop in emergencies. Also, be sure to know the laws of each country for driving in various conditions. I honestly do not know this, but I am sure another poster will. I recall somewhere that if you are involved in an accident or stopped because of road conditions, snow tires or chains may be required in some areas. As we had our own car, I don't know how that works with a rental car.
My last advice is for traveling with your girl. Have you informed her fully as to what the trip might be like? You don't want her to feel trapped in the car after a couple of days. Some people can spend hours in a car - others two or three. If she starts to feel trapped, you might want to have a back up plan for more exploring, walking, cafe, museum time or a plan for ditching the car and going someplace fun and warm. If you really like her (and I guess you do if you want to spend a month with her in Europe), be considerate of her needs, wants and welfare even more than your own.
Jul 30th, 2012, 07:03 AM
#23
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it may not snow at this time though who knows, but you are right.
i guess i will look for some beautiful places nearby, sounds OK!
also i can check the weather for a week ahead " that could change the plans.
now i don't have a plan
i guess i will look for some beautiful places nearby, sounds OK!
also i can check the weather for a week ahead " that could change the plans.
now i don't have a plan
Jul 30th, 2012, 06:01 PM
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<<now i don't have a plan>>
Well, you should have one, because no girl I know would want to sign onto a plan to drive around Europe in December in the ice and snow and look at barren landscapes. Maybe your girl is different.
Well, you should have one, because no girl I know would want to sign onto a plan to drive around Europe in December in the ice and snow and look at barren landscapes. Maybe your girl is different.
Jul 30th, 2012, 11:50 PM
#26
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1- <<<<Maybe your girl is different.>>>>
You know what? i linked her with all of those comments, and she is the one who's still pushing to do this trip the way we planed it!!! yes she is sooo different.
2- <<Are you by any chance an American stationed in Kuwait?>>
No I'm not an American, i am Egyptian, but what websites your talking about anyway?
3- <StCirq> what would you suggest to go and do in case i will be staying in Spain? full plan please.
Thanx a lot to all
You know what? i linked her with all of those comments, and she is the one who's still pushing to do this trip the way we planed it!!! yes she is sooo different.
2- <<Are you by any chance an American stationed in Kuwait?>>
No I'm not an American, i am Egyptian, but what websites your talking about anyway?
3- <StCirq> what would you suggest to go and do in case i will be staying in Spain? full plan please.
Thanx a lot to all
Jul 31st, 2012, 07:07 AM
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<<3- <StCirq> what would you suggest to go and do in case i will be staying in Spain? full plan please...
I'm neither a Spain expert nor a travel agent. And I'm not sure why you are even posting here for suggestions, since you are determined to to everything your own way anyway. You seem to know what you want to do, so just go do it and enjoy.
I'm neither a Spain expert nor a travel agent. And I'm not sure why you are even posting here for suggestions, since you are determined to to everything your own way anyway. You seem to know what you want to do, so just go do it and enjoy.
Jul 31st, 2012, 04:25 PM
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For the best bet on good weather and relatively warmer temperature, regions/areas of countries you mentioned play a big part - also luck, as you can never have a gurantee with the weather anywhere you visit.
We visited Italy three times in December in these last 5 years, and we were lucky enough to have nice weather every time.
Last December we went for a day trip to Madonna di Campiglio in the Dolomite mountains, and though it was freezingly cold compared to Trento which is further to the south of Alto Adige, and in high altitude, it was still a nice day with no snow or rain and my husband drove without any problem. We walked in Trento city quite a few times in the evenings, and I can't say we felt too cold. Good warm jackets, a hat and gloves, and good shoes or boots (even though I did not always use them) plus an umbrella in case of rain, are more than enough.
In certain regions like Trento and Alto Adige by law you have to have in your possession snow chains in the boot of your car, we always have to hire them as we usually like to include a mountaineous region - but till now we have never used them, even at the rental office last December they told us that most probably we would never use them as several inches of rain has to fall - money down the drain, but better that way than being fined. The law does not apply to regions or areas that are not mountaineous.
Temperatures are not so low in various provences in the regions of Tuscany, Liguria (we did not yet visit this region - unfortunately they experienced the heavy rainfall last year) Umbria, even in Emiglia Romagna ( last December we also visited this region - we do like to move around as well - and we walked around many open air places of interest, like the Italia in miniature park, Rimini etc Again, to be on the safer side, avoid day trips to mountaineous areas or high hills (common in Tuscany - again we never encountered problems) if it is rainy weather, as temperatures fall the higher higher altitude, and roads might be icy. I do not think the cold would be unbearable i many areas, it felt much colder when we went to England and Wales for a Christmas holiday way back in 2004.
In December 2007 we went for a few days to the Abruzzo mountains, and stayed in a tiny hamlet called Rocca Pia close to Roccaraso. Again, we found no difficulty to reach it, and again were lucky with the weather, but I have to say it WAS freezingly cold in the evening in Rocca Pia - but there was such a beautiful atmosphere in the small hotel, and in the afternoon till early evening we still went to Roocaraso which is a ski resort, and took some lovely pictures on the snow.
Your main problem, in my opinion is where to pick up and drop off car, since, as another Fodorite pointed out, drop off charges are really high when you deposit car in another country from that of pick-up - even up to 500 Euros. The extra charge is not much is you leave car in another location in the same country, around 50 euro fee. Regarding your long distance travels - I am assuming that both you and your girlfriend do not mind the long drives.
To drive back to the same airport from where you picked up car would be so time-consuming as well as expensive (fuel rates are high everywhere) so what I would do is this, again considering you really want to visit the three countries.
I would land in Toulouse, an airport in France, about three hours and forty five minutes drive to Barcelona. Southern Spain is warmer than the north, like in so many countries - you might be interested in staying in a town or village close to Barcelona, but not in Barcelona itself, as it would not be easy to base yourself in Barcelona and drive in and out of city centre. From there you can do day trips in Spain. You have to preplan this, check out distances etc.
After your week in Spain, I would head eastwards to the south of France, maybe making an overnight stop to break the journey. For the week you have in France you might be either interested in basing yourself in a town on the French Riviera or anywhere inland in Provence, some areas are called the wine country of Provence (the name of the whole region). I am sure several Fodorites who travelled to this region can give you their best recommendations. On the French Riviera you can do trips (or stop for a couple of hours to some well known towns on the coast like Nice, Saint Tropez, Cannes, Cote D'Azur, Monaco etc, or drive inland.
For the next 6 or 7 days in Italy I would base myself in a town close to Pisa, (let's say your accomodation in France is close to Nice - then it would take you about 3 hours and 15 minutes to drive from Nice to Pisa area) from where you can do day trips to the Cinque Terre, and other towns and cities in Tuscany such as Florence, Lucca, San Gimignano and Siena. Avoid finding accomodation in centre of the big towns and cities of Tuscany as it would be so inconvenient to drive to city centres, as there are many restricted areas, and also difficult to find parking. I think finding accomodation at a hotel or apartment on the coast of the provence of Pisa (just to the north there are many lovely coastal towns and villages where you might rent an apartments) would be ideal. Or maybe on the outskirts of Florence at an Agriturismo - some of them rent apartments.
After you stay in Italy I would find the closest airport in France from where you are based in Italy - check out airports of Nice, Cannes, Toulon and Saint Tropez (which are all between 3 to 4 hours' drive. You might even have to drive to Marseilles, which would be over 4 hours' drive. That way you would be returning car to the same country. You might have to stay in accomodation close to airport on the last night - better that way to be on the safe side that you will be on time for your flight as you will have a long drive, unless flight leaves late in the evening. You would probably find an affordable B&B not far from airport if you want to save some money and not stay in a hotel.
Hopefully you and your girlfriend are the types that enjoy long drives, and that you are an experienced driver, as otherwise this long holiday might be a bit too overwhelming for you and your girlfriend. Also take into consideration the high cost of fuel - the hired car will consume plenty of it during this vacation.
We visited Italy three times in December in these last 5 years, and we were lucky enough to have nice weather every time.
Last December we went for a day trip to Madonna di Campiglio in the Dolomite mountains, and though it was freezingly cold compared to Trento which is further to the south of Alto Adige, and in high altitude, it was still a nice day with no snow or rain and my husband drove without any problem. We walked in Trento city quite a few times in the evenings, and I can't say we felt too cold. Good warm jackets, a hat and gloves, and good shoes or boots (even though I did not always use them) plus an umbrella in case of rain, are more than enough.
In certain regions like Trento and Alto Adige by law you have to have in your possession snow chains in the boot of your car, we always have to hire them as we usually like to include a mountaineous region - but till now we have never used them, even at the rental office last December they told us that most probably we would never use them as several inches of rain has to fall - money down the drain, but better that way than being fined. The law does not apply to regions or areas that are not mountaineous.
Temperatures are not so low in various provences in the regions of Tuscany, Liguria (we did not yet visit this region - unfortunately they experienced the heavy rainfall last year) Umbria, even in Emiglia Romagna ( last December we also visited this region - we do like to move around as well - and we walked around many open air places of interest, like the Italia in miniature park, Rimini etc Again, to be on the safer side, avoid day trips to mountaineous areas or high hills (common in Tuscany - again we never encountered problems) if it is rainy weather, as temperatures fall the higher higher altitude, and roads might be icy. I do not think the cold would be unbearable i many areas, it felt much colder when we went to England and Wales for a Christmas holiday way back in 2004.
In December 2007 we went for a few days to the Abruzzo mountains, and stayed in a tiny hamlet called Rocca Pia close to Roccaraso. Again, we found no difficulty to reach it, and again were lucky with the weather, but I have to say it WAS freezingly cold in the evening in Rocca Pia - but there was such a beautiful atmosphere in the small hotel, and in the afternoon till early evening we still went to Roocaraso which is a ski resort, and took some lovely pictures on the snow.
Your main problem, in my opinion is where to pick up and drop off car, since, as another Fodorite pointed out, drop off charges are really high when you deposit car in another country from that of pick-up - even up to 500 Euros. The extra charge is not much is you leave car in another location in the same country, around 50 euro fee. Regarding your long distance travels - I am assuming that both you and your girlfriend do not mind the long drives.
To drive back to the same airport from where you picked up car would be so time-consuming as well as expensive (fuel rates are high everywhere) so what I would do is this, again considering you really want to visit the three countries.
I would land in Toulouse, an airport in France, about three hours and forty five minutes drive to Barcelona. Southern Spain is warmer than the north, like in so many countries - you might be interested in staying in a town or village close to Barcelona, but not in Barcelona itself, as it would not be easy to base yourself in Barcelona and drive in and out of city centre. From there you can do day trips in Spain. You have to preplan this, check out distances etc.
After your week in Spain, I would head eastwards to the south of France, maybe making an overnight stop to break the journey. For the week you have in France you might be either interested in basing yourself in a town on the French Riviera or anywhere inland in Provence, some areas are called the wine country of Provence (the name of the whole region). I am sure several Fodorites who travelled to this region can give you their best recommendations. On the French Riviera you can do trips (or stop for a couple of hours to some well known towns on the coast like Nice, Saint Tropez, Cannes, Cote D'Azur, Monaco etc, or drive inland.
For the next 6 or 7 days in Italy I would base myself in a town close to Pisa, (let's say your accomodation in France is close to Nice - then it would take you about 3 hours and 15 minutes to drive from Nice to Pisa area) from where you can do day trips to the Cinque Terre, and other towns and cities in Tuscany such as Florence, Lucca, San Gimignano and Siena. Avoid finding accomodation in centre of the big towns and cities of Tuscany as it would be so inconvenient to drive to city centres, as there are many restricted areas, and also difficult to find parking. I think finding accomodation at a hotel or apartment on the coast of the provence of Pisa (just to the north there are many lovely coastal towns and villages where you might rent an apartments) would be ideal. Or maybe on the outskirts of Florence at an Agriturismo - some of them rent apartments.
After you stay in Italy I would find the closest airport in France from where you are based in Italy - check out airports of Nice, Cannes, Toulon and Saint Tropez (which are all between 3 to 4 hours' drive. You might even have to drive to Marseilles, which would be over 4 hours' drive. That way you would be returning car to the same country. You might have to stay in accomodation close to airport on the last night - better that way to be on the safe side that you will be on time for your flight as you will have a long drive, unless flight leaves late in the evening. You would probably find an affordable B&B not far from airport if you want to save some money and not stay in a hotel.
Hopefully you and your girlfriend are the types that enjoy long drives, and that you are an experienced driver, as otherwise this long holiday might be a bit too overwhelming for you and your girlfriend. Also take into consideration the high cost of fuel - the hired car will consume plenty of it during this vacation.
Aug 1st, 2012, 01:30 AM
#30
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Anna Galea
Thank you so much for your reply, I do enjoy driving for long, stooping in new places while driving you know it's fun.
Regarding the rental car??
what options do i have for the insurance ( my credit card doesn't cover) and i was looking for a full insurance package. Meaning i will NOT be charged in case the car has been damaged in anyway possible.!!
Thank you so much for your reply, I do enjoy driving for long, stooping in new places while driving you know it's fun.
Regarding the rental car??
what options do i have for the insurance ( my credit card doesn't cover) and i was looking for a full insurance package. Meaning i will NOT be charged in case the car has been damaged in anyway possible.!!
Aug 1st, 2012, 05:05 AM
#31
Frankly, there is a lot less ice and snow in France, Italy and Spain than some people seem to think, as long as you stay out of the mountains. Yes, there can be a surprise storm from time to time, but as long as you pay attention to the weather reports, it generally calls for just a little improvization.
Look at the AutoEurope insurance options, but be aware that certain things are never covered by insurance -- such as the roof of the car!
Look at the AutoEurope insurance options, but be aware that certain things are never covered by insurance -- such as the roof of the car!
Aug 1st, 2012, 07:23 AM
#32
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Ahmed - Even we always purchase the excess insurance, as it is called, at rental office. You buy and pay for it when you pick up hired car, even if you pay full rate for car hire online - that is usually the policy in many countries in Europe
. We always hire with Avis, and lately it is giving extremely good offers and rates, I would say one of the best (I prefer never to use brokers as I want to decide for myself which car hire company I want to choose and not let them choose for me) and I have never had any problems whatsoever when hiring with them. We only once did a minor damage to the car - broken a side window mirror. We informed them about it on returning the car - they took note of it, but of course we were not charged a cent for it since we paid the additional excess insurance - I wouldn't know if that would be the case if we didn't take that extra insurance.
The rate for the excess insurance differs a bit from country to country, and even location of pickup in a particular country and also probably according to duration of holiday (we never do three-week holidays). If I remember well it roughly costs (for a dew days up to a two weeks' holiday, as usually in our case), from 20 to 35 euro per day. By buying the excess insurance, no money would be blocked from your credit card by Avis (Avis never did it to us, a few other car companies still blocked us some money when we still paid for this access insurance - wonder what would have happened if we did experienca some sort of accident whether they would withdraw that blocked money from our account). That is the reason I trust Avis and prefer to pay their daily excess insurance for total peace of mind. I book through the Avis UK website, if you pay online when booking (which is what we always do), you get a discount. You select your preference on 'pay now'. and not 'pay later'. Maybe you can make them make queries for you at the rental office where you are hiring the car on the rate of the excess insurance for three weeks, or phone up the rental office where you pick up the car.
I totally agree with kerouac regarding the climate - if you do not want to risk stay away from mountaineous regions, - saying that some towns in mountaineous regions like Roccaraso in Abruzzo is a very easy road trip.
. We always hire with Avis, and lately it is giving extremely good offers and rates, I would say one of the best (I prefer never to use brokers as I want to decide for myself which car hire company I want to choose and not let them choose for me) and I have never had any problems whatsoever when hiring with them. We only once did a minor damage to the car - broken a side window mirror. We informed them about it on returning the car - they took note of it, but of course we were not charged a cent for it since we paid the additional excess insurance - I wouldn't know if that would be the case if we didn't take that extra insurance.
The rate for the excess insurance differs a bit from country to country, and even location of pickup in a particular country and also probably according to duration of holiday (we never do three-week holidays). If I remember well it roughly costs (for a dew days up to a two weeks' holiday, as usually in our case), from 20 to 35 euro per day. By buying the excess insurance, no money would be blocked from your credit card by Avis (Avis never did it to us, a few other car companies still blocked us some money when we still paid for this access insurance - wonder what would have happened if we did experienca some sort of accident whether they would withdraw that blocked money from our account). That is the reason I trust Avis and prefer to pay their daily excess insurance for total peace of mind. I book through the Avis UK website, if you pay online when booking (which is what we always do), you get a discount. You select your preference on 'pay now'. and not 'pay later'. Maybe you can make them make queries for you at the rental office where you are hiring the car on the rate of the excess insurance for three weeks, or phone up the rental office where you pick up the car.
I totally agree with kerouac regarding the climate - if you do not want to risk stay away from mountaineous regions, - saying that some towns in mountaineous regions like Roccaraso in Abruzzo is a very easy road trip.
Aug 1st, 2012, 08:07 AM
#33
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<i>If I remember well it roughly costs (for a dew days up to a two weeks' holiday, as usually in our case), from 20 to 35 euro per day.</i>
So if there is a 300€ deductible, it might be better to not pay the excess on a rental of more than 15 days. 35€ per day more than doubles the daily cost of my rentals. That's a lot for peace of mind. http://www.economycarrentals.com/ does offer rentals with no excess, but some have said that this is not really true if one reads the fine print.
So if there is a 300€ deductible, it might be better to not pay the excess on a rental of more than 15 days. 35€ per day more than doubles the daily cost of my rentals. That's a lot for peace of mind. http://www.economycarrentals.com/ does offer rentals with no excess, but some have said that this is not really true if one reads the fine print.
Aug 1st, 2012, 02:55 PM
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If you can get a World Master Card (and it must be "World"), and make all car rental charges on that card, they cover damage to the vehicle with no deductible. However, as stated before, there are items on the car that are not covered such as tires and other items listed in the fine print. If there is damage to the car, you must pay for repairs (using the World card), then after submitting all required paperwork, your account is credited. We have relied on this coverage for several years and had no problems being reimbursed for the minor damage we incurred.
Aug 1st, 2012, 02:59 PM
#36
I noted the last time that I checked, AutoEurope now reveals the name of the rental company before you book. (I have a special rate with Europcar now, so I have been sticking with them, but I do cross check with AutoEurope from time to time.)
Aug 1st, 2012, 03:00 PM
#37
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<i>We have relied on this coverage for several years</i>
Even in Italy?
Isn't this credit card coverage limited to residents of certain countries--the U.S., Australia? I do not think that the OP fits under such a restriction (an Egyptian living in Kuwait).
Even in Italy?
Isn't this credit card coverage limited to residents of certain countries--the U.S., Australia? I do not think that the OP fits under such a restriction (an Egyptian living in Kuwait).
Aug 12th, 2012, 01:07 AM
#39
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Thanks to all.
change in plans, sincee everyone a ginst goin through Spain, Paris and Italy in this time of the year ( December).
So i am thinkin about heading south driven through Barcelona, Madrid, Seville,Cordoba, Granada, and Valencia.
Would a prciat better ideas i will be flying (Dec 16 - Jan 12 )
change in plans, sincee everyone a ginst goin through Spain, Paris and Italy in this time of the year ( December).
So i am thinkin about heading south driven through Barcelona, Madrid, Seville,Cordoba, Granada, and Valencia.
Would a prciat better ideas i will be flying (Dec 16 - Jan 12 )
Aug 12th, 2012, 02:19 AM
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The Spain plan sounds good. All the cities mentioned are great and very different. Barcelona and Madrid are the biggest cities and as different as they can be. The Madrid-Barcelona football matches are among the most heated on the planet for both historical, political and football reasons. Sevilla, Córdoba and Granada are full of history and culture and the influence of Moorish al-Andalus is everywhere to see. Valencia is up and coming.
Perhaps spend Christmas time in wonderful Sevilla, and watch out for villancicos (flamenco inspired Christmas songs) in the streets. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ltDBAXXnqI
Córdoba - the most advanced city in the western world arond 10-11th century - has got a quite spectacular New Years Eve celebration on the main Tendillas square.
Perhaps spend Christmas time in wonderful Sevilla, and watch out for villancicos (flamenco inspired Christmas songs) in the streets. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ltDBAXXnqI
Córdoba - the most advanced city in the western world arond 10-11th century - has got a quite spectacular New Years Eve celebration on the main Tendillas square.
