Need help - can we include Évora in our Portuguese itinerary?
Mar 11th, 2009, 07:56 AM
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Need help - can we include Évora in our Portuguese itinerary?
I would welcome comments on two alternative itineraries for our trip to Portugal in May. I'm trying to work out what is feasible within our time constraints and the need to be in Porto for my husband's conference for 4-5 days in the middle of a 12 day trip. We arrive in Lisbon on Saturday and we have to be in Porto for the following Wednesday morning. The conference runs till Saturday then we have 3 more days before we have to leave - we fly out of Porto.
I don't have a detailed itinerary worked out but I'm trying to decide between spending the first 3 days in Lisbon, doing day trips from there, (Sintra, Obidos, Nazare) then driving up the coast on day 4 (Tuesday) stopping somewhere withing striking distance of Porto so we can get there early on day 5. Then after the conference we have a couple days to visit one or two towns near to Porto before returning to the airport.
Alternatively, having heard so much about the area around Évora, should we go straight there the day we arrive, spend two days there, return to Lisbon for two days, then take an early train from Lisbon to Porto?
We both prefer wandering around quaint villages to large cities. We enjoy some museums, but might prefer pottery shops and village markets and just exploring. We love fado music so definitely want to visit fado clubs in Lisbon.
Since we're in our mid/late fifties, we would qualify for the Pousada passport - would it be worthwhile for this trip? I've booked hotels in Porto and for the first 2 nights in Lisbon but I could cancel the Lisbon hotel if we decide to do something different. I've been reading all the threads about Portugal and have learned a lot there, as well as from various guidebooks, but I still feel at a loss - Portugal seems so unknown to me. I guess in the last few years we've gotten comfortable returning to countries we've visited several times, like France and Spain, so branching out into the unknown is a bit of a challenge. But I'm looking forward to it, and I know I can rely on advice from the experts here on this forum. So thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.
I don't have a detailed itinerary worked out but I'm trying to decide between spending the first 3 days in Lisbon, doing day trips from there, (Sintra, Obidos, Nazare) then driving up the coast on day 4 (Tuesday) stopping somewhere withing striking distance of Porto so we can get there early on day 5. Then after the conference we have a couple days to visit one or two towns near to Porto before returning to the airport.
Alternatively, having heard so much about the area around Évora, should we go straight there the day we arrive, spend two days there, return to Lisbon for two days, then take an early train from Lisbon to Porto?
We both prefer wandering around quaint villages to large cities. We enjoy some museums, but might prefer pottery shops and village markets and just exploring. We love fado music so definitely want to visit fado clubs in Lisbon.
Since we're in our mid/late fifties, we would qualify for the Pousada passport - would it be worthwhile for this trip? I've booked hotels in Porto and for the first 2 nights in Lisbon but I could cancel the Lisbon hotel if we decide to do something different. I've been reading all the threads about Portugal and have learned a lot there, as well as from various guidebooks, but I still feel at a loss - Portugal seems so unknown to me. I guess in the last few years we've gotten comfortable returning to countries we've visited several times, like France and Spain, so branching out into the unknown is a bit of a challenge. But I'm looking forward to it, and I know I can rely on advice from the experts here on this forum. So thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.
Mar 11th, 2009, 08:23 AM
#2
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 9,023
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not in your question if you love old small towns and Pousadas consider stopping at Obidos on your way north and staying in the swell Pousada there that is built into the towns ramparts - an ancient building in a very ancient town - one of Europe's finest walled town IMO.
I think the things en route to Porto - Obidos, Batalha Monastery, Alcobaca monastery and especially Coimbra - with its fabubulous old town part and Navarre - a colorful fishing village that makes a nice overnight - women dressed in black grill fish in the narrow lanes you can dine on - offers more all told than does the desolated Evora area.
Evora itself is a nice old town with a famous chapel of bones - human bones and you go thru the cork growing area - unique but Evora can be an easy day trip by car or train from Lisbon.
Porto to me is the gem of Portugal - dozens of azuelo-studded churches and an old-work look that vanished from much of modern Europe.
I think the things en route to Porto - Obidos, Batalha Monastery, Alcobaca monastery and especially Coimbra - with its fabubulous old town part and Navarre - a colorful fishing village that makes a nice overnight - women dressed in black grill fish in the narrow lanes you can dine on - offers more all told than does the desolated Evora area.
Evora itself is a nice old town with a famous chapel of bones - human bones and you go thru the cork growing area - unique but Evora can be an easy day trip by car or train from Lisbon.
Porto to me is the gem of Portugal - dozens of azuelo-studded churches and an old-work look that vanished from much of modern Europe.
Mar 11th, 2009, 08:53 AM
#3
Hi; Just a few more possible places to visit going north to Porto. Plus, I think you may want to travel a little further north than Obidos. [It's beautifull and we are staying there in April.] However, you may wany to stay in a town that is nearer to the mid-point from Lisbon to Porto. That town would be Ourem, a fortified city of 5000. All that Palenque sugested are lovely places to visit. Mafra Mosastery is another. The town of Tomar is great and near Ourem. Just north and west of Porto, you have two good places to visit Braga and Guimaraes. Pousada's are very nice and you could possible find one near tomar or Ourem. Go on www.amazon.com and buy a 'Michelin green guide' and map on Portugal. Then you can map out your route. Enjoy iris1745/dick
Mar 11th, 2009, 09:33 AM
#4
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You have to many very good options. My advise would be to stay more days in less places. My first visit to Evora was last Spring, two nights on my way to Sevilla. We wished we had more time in Evora! The Lisbon area is wonderfull. I've been many times and would still enjoy a full week there. If Porto doesn't keep you busy you have good suggestions from the other posters. I feel the same about Guimaraes as I do about Evora! Then there is the Upper Douro, rustic simple, friendly, I can't wait to back there!
I've been to Portugal eight times in twelve years, it's all great.
Best advice....more time in less places.
tico
I've been to Portugal eight times in twelve years, it's all great.
Best advice....more time in less places.
tico
Mar 11th, 2009, 10:54 AM
#5
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks so much for your responses. The consensus seems to be that we should forget about Evora for this trip! I have made notes of all the suggestions of places to visit. Now I just have to arrange them in a logical sequence. I think it's starting to come together - it's easier once I omit Evora.
How's this - spend 2 nights in Lisbon, do a walking tour of the city the first day, visit Sintra the next, using public transport. Then on Monday, rent a car, drive to Obidos, spend the night there, Tuesday drive to Ourem, Wednesday morning drive to Porto. Can we fit in Navare, Coimbra or the monasteries Palenque mentioned along that route? (I have to find a good map, but I'm at work and my guidebooks are at home)
Are Braga and Guimaraes day trips from Porto or best done overnight? I will need to come up with things to do on my own for some of the days in Porto. Any ideas?
How's this - spend 2 nights in Lisbon, do a walking tour of the city the first day, visit Sintra the next, using public transport. Then on Monday, rent a car, drive to Obidos, spend the night there, Tuesday drive to Ourem, Wednesday morning drive to Porto. Can we fit in Navare, Coimbra or the monasteries Palenque mentioned along that route? (I have to find a good map, but I'm at work and my guidebooks are at home)
Are Braga and Guimaraes day trips from Porto or best done overnight? I will need to come up with things to do on my own for some of the days in Porto. Any ideas?
Mar 11th, 2009, 11:20 AM
#6
Hi; Both Braga and Guimaraes are day trips from Porto. If you decide to stay in Obidos, then you should consider staying in Coimbra. [Ourem is within fifty miles of Obidos.] Obidos is perhaps only an hour from the airport. Navare is only a few miles north of Obidos and you could visit there and then back to the Pousada. Batalha and Alcobaca are also close by if time permits. The next morning, on the way to Coimbra, you could chose to visit, Ourem and Tomar. Never been to Porto, so Palenque will help. But from Coimbra to Porto is only 1 1/2 hours and a good stop would be Aveiro. iris1745/dick
Mar 11th, 2009, 01:26 PM
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks, dick.
I think the Pousadas make most sense if we spend 5 nights in Pousadas to get the best value for the Golden age passport. Has anyone used those - I know tower has, if he's around. Just wondering if you have to buy the pass first, then make the reservations.
I think the Pousadas make most sense if we spend 5 nights in Pousadas to get the best value for the Golden age passport. Has anyone used those - I know tower has, if he's around. Just wondering if you have to buy the pass first, then make the reservations.
Trending Topics
Mar 11th, 2009, 01:36 PM
#8
Hi; You can find information on this web site. Some Pousadas may not be available using the 'passport'. I think you will have to pay up-front. www.pousadasportugal.com iris1745/dick
Mar 12th, 2009, 04:18 AM
#9
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi, Baladeuse, I had the bad luck of writing a response when the website was up and running and then trying to post it when it went down for maintenance, but by then it was too late to save it. grrrr.
I agree with those who encourage you to put Evora on the "to do" list, because it really takes you away from your Lisbon-Porto axis.
I think that your idea of spending the first night in Obidos on the way up to Porto gives you either an overly leisurely day or a day requiring you to drive north towards Porto (to visit Alcobaca, Nazare or Batalhs) and then back south to Obidos. So, much as I think Obidos is a great little place for a couple hours of strolling through a walled in city, enjoying the views from the ramparts, etc, and buying overpriced low quality (for the most part)tourist stuff, I think that you would use your limited time better by going there first thing out of Lisbon, then moving north to visit one or more of these three -- Alcobaca (monastery), Nazare (former fishing village turned tourist resort but still pretty and with great fish restaurants), or Batalha (beautiful, absolutely beautiful gothic church along with the monastery). I haven't been to the Ourem pousada, but that's a pretty good location for what you have in mind. (Another possibility, a bit further north would be Conimbriga, with its Roman ruins -- while not spectacular, they are Portugal's best).
For your second day, there are plenty of places between Lisbon and Porto you might want to visit (Coimbra and Aveiro being two that other people have mentioned that are nice), but if you have ever been attracted to the Douro Valley, I think you would have time to drive east and south of Porto along the river for your day before going to Porto. There are several Douro posts here and since you're a fan of pousadas, I think the Mesao Frio pousada is really special, incredible views from way up high.
(And the pousada people have an incredible 70E/night price on their website, along with other deals)http://www.pousadas.pt/historicalhotels/EN
Braga and Guimaraes are both probably well-served by public transportation from Porto and would be great day trips. I particularly like Guimaraes, really charming.
As far as staying in pousadas, I don't think the Portuguese still have their five day passport like the Spaniards, but I could be wrong. I just don't see it on the website. The "golden age" (love those euphemisms) price is on a night by night basis, it's 40% off the rack rate, Sunday through Thursday. But given some of the other offers, it's not always the cheapest price. I also think that the "clickable" map on the pousada website is very helpful to find the places closest to the route you want to take.
I was in Obidos last week with some friends, and we were chatting with the guy at the desk in the pousada, who told me that he is now authorized to "make deals" on price with potential guests. If this highly coveted, close to Lisbon, 9 room pousada is having trouble filling the beds, that tells you something. I stayed there in 2004 during Christmas and needed three rooms. In October I was only able to book two, but luckily there was a cancellation for the third. This is quite a difference. The recession has hit Portugal pretty badly, so I assume tourism is taking a dive as well.
Distances are quite small here -- Lisbon to Porto is 300 km and many Portuguese make that trip in 2 1/2 hours (going a "wee bit" over the 120 km speed limit). I am much more cautious but have made it door to door in 3 hours 15 minutes with one very quick stop. The tollways are very good (though they don't give you too much of a sense of Portugal) and most of the places on your list between Lisbon and Porto aren't far from a tollway.
Anyway, you have a lot of very tempting options that just depend on the kind of touring you like to do. Happy planning, Laurie
I agree with those who encourage you to put Evora on the "to do" list, because it really takes you away from your Lisbon-Porto axis.
I think that your idea of spending the first night in Obidos on the way up to Porto gives you either an overly leisurely day or a day requiring you to drive north towards Porto (to visit Alcobaca, Nazare or Batalhs) and then back south to Obidos. So, much as I think Obidos is a great little place for a couple hours of strolling through a walled in city, enjoying the views from the ramparts, etc, and buying overpriced low quality (for the most part)tourist stuff, I think that you would use your limited time better by going there first thing out of Lisbon, then moving north to visit one or more of these three -- Alcobaca (monastery), Nazare (former fishing village turned tourist resort but still pretty and with great fish restaurants), or Batalha (beautiful, absolutely beautiful gothic church along with the monastery). I haven't been to the Ourem pousada, but that's a pretty good location for what you have in mind. (Another possibility, a bit further north would be Conimbriga, with its Roman ruins -- while not spectacular, they are Portugal's best).
For your second day, there are plenty of places between Lisbon and Porto you might want to visit (Coimbra and Aveiro being two that other people have mentioned that are nice), but if you have ever been attracted to the Douro Valley, I think you would have time to drive east and south of Porto along the river for your day before going to Porto. There are several Douro posts here and since you're a fan of pousadas, I think the Mesao Frio pousada is really special, incredible views from way up high.
(And the pousada people have an incredible 70E/night price on their website, along with other deals)http://www.pousadas.pt/historicalhotels/EN
Braga and Guimaraes are both probably well-served by public transportation from Porto and would be great day trips. I particularly like Guimaraes, really charming.
As far as staying in pousadas, I don't think the Portuguese still have their five day passport like the Spaniards, but I could be wrong. I just don't see it on the website. The "golden age" (love those euphemisms) price is on a night by night basis, it's 40% off the rack rate, Sunday through Thursday. But given some of the other offers, it's not always the cheapest price. I also think that the "clickable" map on the pousada website is very helpful to find the places closest to the route you want to take.
I was in Obidos last week with some friends, and we were chatting with the guy at the desk in the pousada, who told me that he is now authorized to "make deals" on price with potential guests. If this highly coveted, close to Lisbon, 9 room pousada is having trouble filling the beds, that tells you something. I stayed there in 2004 during Christmas and needed three rooms. In October I was only able to book two, but luckily there was a cancellation for the third. This is quite a difference. The recession has hit Portugal pretty badly, so I assume tourism is taking a dive as well.
Distances are quite small here -- Lisbon to Porto is 300 km and many Portuguese make that trip in 2 1/2 hours (going a "wee bit" over the 120 km speed limit). I am much more cautious but have made it door to door in 3 hours 15 minutes with one very quick stop. The tollways are very good (though they don't give you too much of a sense of Portugal) and most of the places on your list between Lisbon and Porto aren't far from a tollway.
Anyway, you have a lot of very tempting options that just depend on the kind of touring you like to do. Happy planning, Laurie
Mar 12th, 2009, 06:27 PM
#10
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 371
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wow, thanks so much for all this great information, Laurie, and for typing it TWICE! This really helps a lot with my planning. I will definitely check out those deals you mentioned, and you've really helped me figure out how to fit in many of the places I've been reading about. Too bad we can't make it to Evora but it will be something to look forward to on another trip.
Thanks again to everyone.
Thanks again to everyone.
