CCSeefer

I will be traveling to Italy early next year and will be there for a total of 106 days, including the day I arrive and the day I leave. I understand that I can stay for up to 90 days without a Visa. That means that I need to spend 16 days out of the Schengen-state countries so that I don't violate the Schengen provisions. Here are my questions:

1. How are the 90 days calculated? Does the day I arrive in Italy count as Day 1? How about the day I leave Italy?

2. I plan to travel to Prague and Budapest during my stay in Italy, which are both non-Schengen states. Does the day I leave Italy count as a day in a Schengen state? What about the day I arrive back in Italy? Are there any other entry requirements for Prague and Budapest of which I should be aware?

3. I understand that Switzerland has signed the Schengen state agreement. When will this go into effect? Will I still be able to spend time in Switzerland in February-April 2007 without it counting toward my stay in a Schengen state?

4. Is there anything else I should know or do to make sure that I don't exceed my 90 days in Italy?

I don't have much travel experience in Europe, and certainly never for this extended period of time, so any advice you can give me would be greatly appeciated. I want to make sure I do everything right! Grazie!

Carolyn

flanneruk

Most non-Europeans from affluent countries may stay visa-free in the whole Schengen area up to 90 days in any 180. That is, day 91 of your time in Schengen must be 180 days after your first day in the area

So if you go to Czech or Hungary after 90 days in Italy, you can't legally re-enter Italy for another 90 days.

You may wish to reconsider your other questions in the light of this. Or just get the right visa.

There is no definite date yet for Switzerland's joining. Don't bet on its joining next year though: its information systems have to conform to that used in the rest of Schengen.

It may not surprise you to learn that:
Schengen is upgrading its information system, the project is behindhand and Switzerland may delay its joining to 2008 because of this.

Alec

The day you enter Schengen and the day you leave aren't counted as part of 90 days you are allowed to stay. Even then, you will be in Italy for 104 days, 14 days longer than allowed. There is no legal way of extending your stay - going to a non-Schengen country and coming back won't work as your total stay will still exceed 90 days in 180 days.
Schengen information system (SIS) flanneruk talks about doesn't track individual traveller's movements in and out of Schengen - it acts as a database for those who are wanted by the authorities in any Schengen state, on a warnings list and those who should be banned from entering on account of previous immigration offence etc. Control is reliant on more internal surveillance, and then the onus is on you to show you haven't violated any of the Schengen rules by showing travel tickets, accommodation receipts and so on.

kerouac

Generally, it is easy to get away with overstaying, especially if they don't run your passport through a scanner upon arrival -- then there is no official record of the day you arrived except for the airline records. On land borders, you are generally waved through without even a glance at the passport -- however, if you think you might need to prove that you were not in Italy the entire time, be sure to save any receipts that you get from out of the Schengen zone. Finally, it is important to know that if you overstay your rights and anything happens to you, your insurance might not cover you due to your illegal status.

CCSeefer

Thanks to all of you for your quick and helpful replies. Alec, you mentioned that traveling to a non-Schengen state and then returning to Italy won't help me with the 90-day issue. I was told that only days I spend in a Schengen state are counted toward the 90 day maximum. What if I keep documentation? Will this help?

Carolyn

logos999

>if they don't run your passport through a scanner upon arrival
They always do this with my passport for years, even at the Swiss border.

Alec

Carolyn
What I said was that if on day 80, you leave Italy for 5 days in Slovenia, you can return to Italy and stay further 10 days. In this case, even though you leave 95 days after first arriving, you only stayed 90 in Schengen. But, as you propose, you are going to spend more than 90 days in Italy, leaving Schengen in the meantime doesn't help and you cannot stay more than 90 days in total in a timespan of 180 days since first arriving in Schengen.

JeffreyJ

Hmmmmm....does the limit apply to any one of the Schengen states, or to the area as a whole?

Does the ninety day limit apply to all of the Schengen area? Say....you spend fifty days in France, then move onto Italy for another thirty, and then to Germany for another twenty? Would that put you in violation?

flanneruk

The limit applies to the area as a whole.

alanRow

Best thing to do is think of Schengen as a single country and the visa rules apply to that single country.

At least time out of Schengen is counted as time out of Schengen unlike the schemes other countries run.

MaureenB

Why not just apply for a Schengen visa? It's a pain, especially if you don't live in a city where the service is offered, because you must appear in person. But it would alleviate any chance of getting into trouble over there. You won't want to be worried while you're there, or be nervous everytime your passport is stamped.
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WallyKringen

Since there are really only two weeks by which you will be over the 90-day limit for the Schengen area, why not fly on an open-jaw ticket that flies into an airport inside the Schengen area, and home from either Prag or Budapest? Then you do your Czech Republic / Hungary portion after you've spent your 90 days or so in Italy or other Schengen states, and by day 90 you're out of there, and by day 104 you're up up and away without risking a bureaucratic annoyance?

kerouac

Hmmm... is it time to take exception to the idea that the rules of the EU are merely a 'bureaucratic annoyance'? Like the Patriot Act, etc., perhaps?

J62

A guy I work with complains all the time about these "bureaucratic annoyances" (such as needing to get a visa to Russia this summer) when he wants to travel, and at the same time is also arguing for stricter US boarder control "they" don't enter the US illegally.

Go figure.