Using Debit Card, Credit Card and ATM Machine
Apr 30th, 2013, 07:01 PM
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Using Debit Card, Credit Card and ATM Machine
We are traveling to Italy next week and will be taking cash with us, but do not know if wee should take plenty or just enough for a few days. Do you advise to use Debit Cards, Credit Cards and withdrawing cash from the ATM machines in Italy.
Please provide examples you have experienced on all 3 or some of the above 3 payment methods.
Thanks!
Izabella
Please provide examples you have experienced on all 3 or some of the above 3 payment methods.
Thanks!
Izabella
Apr 30th, 2013, 07:14 PM
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I always take enough only for a few days. Unless you bank with an obscure bank that isn't part of the international ATM networks, you should have no problems at all taking euros out of an ATM.
While you may find places where you can't use your credit card (primarily in machines where you have to type in the PIN and in some places away from tourist zones that aren't used to taking U.S.-style credit cards), I've found in the past couple of years that this is just not a major problem for me, but it does depend on where you are.
You should certainly call your various banks and inform them of your trip and where you are traveling so they don't put a block on your cards when they are used overseas.
Never take cash out of an ATM with your credit card, however. And when I am traveling abroad, I never under any circumstances use my debit card to pay for something. First, it may not work, but more important, if your card is compromised, then the thieves get cash out of your account, not just credit against your card. And you don't want to have to deal with that issue while traveling. Use your debit card strictly as an ATM card and you should be fine.
While you may find places where you can't use your credit card (primarily in machines where you have to type in the PIN and in some places away from tourist zones that aren't used to taking U.S.-style credit cards), I've found in the past couple of years that this is just not a major problem for me, but it does depend on where you are.
You should certainly call your various banks and inform them of your trip and where you are traveling so they don't put a block on your cards when they are used overseas.
Never take cash out of an ATM with your credit card, however. And when I am traveling abroad, I never under any circumstances use my debit card to pay for something. First, it may not work, but more important, if your card is compromised, then the thieves get cash out of your account, not just credit against your card. And you don't want to have to deal with that issue while traveling. Use your debit card strictly as an ATM card and you should be fine.
Apr 30th, 2013, 07:15 PM
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You shouldn't be taking cash with you at all. You should plan to use a cc for major purchases like hotels and big restaurant bills. The rest of the time, use your debit card to get cash from ATMs. Mzke sure you notify your bank ahead of time that you'll be making foreign transactions. Have them raise your daily withdrawal limit if necessary. It's really risky to take a lot of cash with you, and totally unnecessary. Bancomats are everywhere.
Apr 30th, 2013, 07:32 PM
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Before you leave:
Call your card company or go online and notify of foreign travel.
Know your pin.
Know your daily withdrawl limit.
Upon arrival:
At bank or hotel ATM, withdraw enough € for a few days of small purchases and food. I usually withdraw about €250-500 depending on the need.
Use your credit card for larger purchases, expensive souveniers, hotel, car hire, train passes (not tickets) etc.
I use Capital One credit card because of the favorable exchange rate. Debit cards usually have a higher rate. Exchange booths are almost always a bad deal as is exchanging US dollars.
Call your card company or go online and notify of foreign travel.
Know your pin.
Know your daily withdrawl limit.
Upon arrival:
At bank or hotel ATM, withdraw enough € for a few days of small purchases and food. I usually withdraw about €250-500 depending on the need.
Use your credit card for larger purchases, expensive souveniers, hotel, car hire, train passes (not tickets) etc.
I use Capital One credit card because of the favorable exchange rate. Debit cards usually have a higher rate. Exchange booths are almost always a bad deal as is exchanging US dollars.
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Apr 30th, 2013, 07:43 PM
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Toucan, I have a capital One card. What is the exchange rate. I have not called yet, but do you recall off the top of your head what the rate is?
I called Chase bank and they said they charge 3% plus $5 per transaction. I wonder if this is for both ATM withdrawals and purchases using the bank card? I did not ask this wuestion, but will ask tomorrow.
I called Chase bank and they said they charge 3% plus $5 per transaction. I wonder if this is for both ATM withdrawals and purchases using the bank card? I did not ask this wuestion, but will ask tomorrow.
Apr 30th, 2013, 07:58 PM
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Some banks, such as Wells Fargo, have branches that will change dollars into euros at a very attractive rate; far better and easier than waiting until you get to Europe.
You can rely on an ATM card, but just be aware that it is super risky. ATM cards sometimes get eaten, and if the bank is closed for the weekend you may have to postpone your vacation as you wait around several days to get your card back. Cloning is a constant problem, and if your account is drained of funds it can take weeks and thousands of dollars worth of hassle to get your money replaced.
Of course, if it makes you feel good to walk around broke, just take an ATM card and hope for the best. Also, don't visit Greece, Cyprus, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Slovenia, or any other country that might freeze ATM transactions as they seize bank accounts.
You can rely on an ATM card, but just be aware that it is super risky. ATM cards sometimes get eaten, and if the bank is closed for the weekend you may have to postpone your vacation as you wait around several days to get your card back. Cloning is a constant problem, and if your account is drained of funds it can take weeks and thousands of dollars worth of hassle to get your money replaced.
Of course, if it makes you feel good to walk around broke, just take an ATM card and hope for the best. Also, don't visit Greece, Cyprus, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Slovenia, or any other country that might freeze ATM transactions as they seize bank accounts.
Apr 30th, 2013, 08:03 PM
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<<You can rely on an ATM card, but just be aware that it is super risky. ATM cards sometimes get eaten>>
It's not super risky, not even mildly risky. What are you talking about? I've owned a home in France for 20+ years, always take just my ATM card for cash, and never, not once, had a single problem except for the occasional blip on Sunday afternoons in France when I think the banks there are doing some sort of catch-up with their correspondent banks in the USA and there's a couple-hour wait until it all works out again.
Nonsense.
It's not super risky, not even mildly risky. What are you talking about? I've owned a home in France for 20+ years, always take just my ATM card for cash, and never, not once, had a single problem except for the occasional blip on Sunday afternoons in France when I think the banks there are doing some sort of catch-up with their correspondent banks in the USA and there's a couple-hour wait until it all works out again.
Nonsense.
Apr 30th, 2013, 08:28 PM
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Bella,
This may help
http://flyerguide.com/wiki/index.php...reign_Exchange
The exchange rate is set by the network, Visa/Plus - MasterCard /Cirrus, so the rate is the same for credit cards and debit cards but the fees may be different.
I don't think that a 5% markup by Wells Fargo is an attractive rate and don't believe that an ATM in Italy is any more risky than one in your home town.
This may help
http://flyerguide.com/wiki/index.php...reign_Exchange
The exchange rate is set by the network, Visa/Plus - MasterCard /Cirrus, so the rate is the same for credit cards and debit cards but the fees may be different.
I don't think that a 5% markup by Wells Fargo is an attractive rate and don't believe that an ATM in Italy is any more risky than one in your home town.
Apr 30th, 2013, 08:58 PM
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Fhurdle is a novice. Wells Fargo is a rip-off! I've heard that Capital One is the best deal, but I use the World Bank Credit Union for overseas transactions of all kinds and get the absolutely best deals around...sadly, not available to everyone. But Wells Fargo? I don't think so.
Apr 30th, 2013, 09:13 PM
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Bella, I can't recall the exact exchange rate (was last in Italy in 2011) but I remember coming home and poring over the statements for Cap One and Chase and there was a big difference in fees but a small difference in the exchange rate (maybe 1%). I resolved to thereafter only use Cap One and have saved money doing so in London, Israel and Central America since then and have always got the best deal with it.
StCirq, I agree changing money before departure isn't usually a good deal or idea but maybe you could be a little less disagreeable in your responses. We all have different experiences, doesn't necessarily make us a unworthy of posting.
StCirq, I agree changing money before departure isn't usually a good deal or idea but maybe you could be a little less disagreeable in your responses. We all have different experiences, doesn't necessarily make us a unworthy of posting.
May 1st, 2013, 05:06 AM
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There's something of a misconception here. The "exchange rate" is not tied to the card. It's the Interbank rate (the rate banks pay for various currencies at the time the transaction is processed), and it constantly changes.
The thing that varies in ATM withdrawals is the fees. You generally pay a 3% foreign transaction fee on every transaction abroad, either an ATM withdrawal or a purchase. 1% of that is from the bank network, the rest from Chase. Then Chase charges you $5 on top of that for every transaction or withdrawal on your debit card (or it may just charge the fee for ATM withdrawals). Needless to say, everyone who tells you this is a rip-off is correct.
Chase may or may not have a preferred banking partner in Italy from which you can withdraw funds without that $5 fee, or it may not. I try to mitigate such fees by taking out more money at a time (200 euros for example). That adds about 2% more for a total of 5% on each 200 euro withdrawal.
To compare, you usually lose 6% to 10% on each currency exchange done in cash. There is usually no charge for these, but the fee is incorporated into the bad exchange rate. So you are always doing marginally better with an ATM withdrawal, and if you can find a way to avoid the $5 transaction fee, you are doing much better.
The thing that varies in ATM withdrawals is the fees. You generally pay a 3% foreign transaction fee on every transaction abroad, either an ATM withdrawal or a purchase. 1% of that is from the bank network, the rest from Chase. Then Chase charges you $5 on top of that for every transaction or withdrawal on your debit card (or it may just charge the fee for ATM withdrawals). Needless to say, everyone who tells you this is a rip-off is correct.
Chase may or may not have a preferred banking partner in Italy from which you can withdraw funds without that $5 fee, or it may not. I try to mitigate such fees by taking out more money at a time (200 euros for example). That adds about 2% more for a total of 5% on each 200 euro withdrawal.
To compare, you usually lose 6% to 10% on each currency exchange done in cash. There is usually no charge for these, but the fee is incorporated into the bad exchange rate. So you are always doing marginally better with an ATM withdrawal, and if you can find a way to avoid the $5 transaction fee, you are doing much better.
May 1st, 2013, 09:53 AM
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>>Fhurdle is a novice. Wells Fargo is a rip-off! I've heard that Capital One is the best deal, but I use the World Bank Credit Union for overseas transactions of all kinds and get the absolutely best deals around...sadly, not available to everyone. But Wells Fargo? I don't think so.<<
I am far from a novice. I would guess I’ve been to Europe 15 to 20 times. On my most recent trips I’ve chosen to change money in advance. I personally have seen my wife’s ATM card get eaten in Europe at a bank that would not reopen for almost 72 hours. Fortunately I had plenty of Greenbacks plus a couple of credit cards, but if I had followed the advice of many on this board and refused to carry any cash dollars it would have been a disaster. I guess we would have had to cancel part of our trip and wait for three days for the bank to reopen.
I personally have witnessed almost $2,000 being drained from my wife’s checking account by ATM card fraudsters. We got the money back after two weeks, but it was a pain. A cousin had more than $20,000 drained from his account. The American banks are still reimbursing their customers for this type of fraud, even though they aren’t required to, but British banks in many cases are declining to make their customers whole.
My recollection is that on my last trip I paid Wells Fargo a four percent premium on my euro purchase, plus five dollars (waived for customers). In looking at their online rates this seems to have increased to five percent, or else the in-person rate is better than the mail rate. And through Wells Fargo one can get all one’s money needs at once. No need to spend hour after hour after hour searching for an ATM machine that works and will take one’s particular card.
Most ATM withdrawals are not as “free” as everyone makes out. Most have a foreign transaction fee of several percent plus service charges. Add these up and its often cheaper and always easier to just get one’s money up front for a four or five percent premium. I’m sure someone will chime in that they know of a bank that doesn’t charge these fees. Most people do business with their hometown bank and have no desire whatsoever to open myriad accounts necessitating constant transfers back and forth.
I am not saying one shouldn’t use credit cards, even though these, too, often incur fees. But getting the Euros up front at a reasonable rate is better than being stuck in Europe with no money.
I am far from a novice. I would guess I’ve been to Europe 15 to 20 times. On my most recent trips I’ve chosen to change money in advance. I personally have seen my wife’s ATM card get eaten in Europe at a bank that would not reopen for almost 72 hours. Fortunately I had plenty of Greenbacks plus a couple of credit cards, but if I had followed the advice of many on this board and refused to carry any cash dollars it would have been a disaster. I guess we would have had to cancel part of our trip and wait for three days for the bank to reopen.
I personally have witnessed almost $2,000 being drained from my wife’s checking account by ATM card fraudsters. We got the money back after two weeks, but it was a pain. A cousin had more than $20,000 drained from his account. The American banks are still reimbursing their customers for this type of fraud, even though they aren’t required to, but British banks in many cases are declining to make their customers whole.
My recollection is that on my last trip I paid Wells Fargo a four percent premium on my euro purchase, plus five dollars (waived for customers). In looking at their online rates this seems to have increased to five percent, or else the in-person rate is better than the mail rate. And through Wells Fargo one can get all one’s money needs at once. No need to spend hour after hour after hour searching for an ATM machine that works and will take one’s particular card.
Most ATM withdrawals are not as “free” as everyone makes out. Most have a foreign transaction fee of several percent plus service charges. Add these up and its often cheaper and always easier to just get one’s money up front for a four or five percent premium. I’m sure someone will chime in that they know of a bank that doesn’t charge these fees. Most people do business with their hometown bank and have no desire whatsoever to open myriad accounts necessitating constant transfers back and forth.
I am not saying one shouldn’t use credit cards, even though these, too, often incur fees. But getting the Euros up front at a reasonable rate is better than being stuck in Europe with no money.
May 1st, 2013, 10:36 AM
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Unless you are continually (several times a day) pulling out small amounts - 25 or 50 euros - and thus piling up transaction fees - there is no way that 3% becomes 10%. And the banks in europe do not charge a fee - it's all from your home bank.
As for ATM transactions being dangerous - I haven't been to the bank in more than 2 years - do everything on line or through ATMs and have NEVER had a problem - either in the US or europe.
You seem to have some sort of cash fetish - when in fact carrying around large amounts is probably the most dangerous thing you can do - as well as the most expensive.
As for the "good deals" at US banks - look at the exchange rate and the fees and see how much you are really paying (I hae never seen less than 8 or 9%).
As for ATM transactions being dangerous - I haven't been to the bank in more than 2 years - do everything on line or through ATMs and have NEVER had a problem - either in the US or europe.
You seem to have some sort of cash fetish - when in fact carrying around large amounts is probably the most dangerous thing you can do - as well as the most expensive.
As for the "good deals" at US banks - look at the exchange rate and the fees and see how much you are really paying (I hae never seen less than 8 or 9%).
May 1st, 2013, 11:42 AM
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nytraveler, I never said 3% became 10%.
The Wells Fargo rate I quoted you is a five percent premium over the spot rate plus five dollars, nothing more. I have looked at the exchange rate and that is how I figured that they were charging five percent. There are no hidden fees whatsoever.
We've had bad experiences with ATM cards. It certainly changes our view of them. Aside from the bad experiences, when using them successfully in Europe we often had to visit several ATM machines to get one that would accept our card.
I do have a cash fetish. I think it is better to have cash and not need it than to need cash and not have it. By my calculation it is not more expensive than using an ATM and a lot more convenient.
I just hope that people will realize that there is another viewpoint out there, and that carrying actual Euros with you when you go is for many people just as economical as using their ATM card.
The Wells Fargo rate I quoted you is a five percent premium over the spot rate plus five dollars, nothing more. I have looked at the exchange rate and that is how I figured that they were charging five percent. There are no hidden fees whatsoever.
We've had bad experiences with ATM cards. It certainly changes our view of them. Aside from the bad experiences, when using them successfully in Europe we often had to visit several ATM machines to get one that would accept our card.
I do have a cash fetish. I think it is better to have cash and not need it than to need cash and not have it. By my calculation it is not more expensive than using an ATM and a lot more convenient.
I just hope that people will realize that there is another viewpoint out there, and that carrying actual Euros with you when you go is for many people just as economical as using their ATM card.
