rogeruktm

hey flanneruk, are you telling me that dogs are allowed on trains? Goats and pigs too?

flanneruk

I've no idea about goats and pigs.

Of course dogs are allowed on trains. Why would they not be? And are you saying there are places where they're NOT welcome on trains?

rogeruktm

flanneruk, dogs are good, but I question what one does when they need to go pee and poop while on the train. Actually, now that you mention it, I do remember people with lap dogs on some trains. Never understood why they take them along, but it's your country and it will not deter me from taking more train trips.

TheFlannerpooch

"I question what one does when they need to go pee and poop while on the train"

Do you pee in your living room? Or poo?

If I want to go to the loo while I'm on a train, I wait till we get off. I don't poo on the house carpets, so I'm not going to poo on the train carpets either. And surely you don't think I'd use those filthy train lavatories you humans use?

The Boss might only have half a brain. But when we're travelling, he at least has the sense to make sure I go to the loo beforehand. So do everyone else's bosses.

Daniel_Williams

Thank you all for your thoughts on Winchester; I'm heavily leaning that way now... After all, if Winchester town centre is only 25 minutes after a taxi to the train station from Southampton Docks, it doesn't seem like too much wear-and-tear on my perhaps future tired self to get to Winchester... sometimes it takes longer than 25 minutes to even get downtown from certain city airports.

I'm gathering Southampton seems like perhaps a modestly better hub for exploration, Winchester seems an OK hub and the prospect of waking up to a lovelier surrounding is quite compelling.

Thanks again to all (Flanneruk, willit, Cholmondley Warner, janisj, JudyC, big smile to you all) for your opinions to help process these choices.

DANIEL

DANIEL

Daniel_Williams

I was just toying about with the website www.nationalrail.co.uk and noticed that Southampton to Bath, Brighton or Salisbury are direct trains taking on average about half an hour *each way* faster than from Winchester to any of these three locations and plus from Winchester, the trains require a connection somewhere (which one I imagine might potentially miss due to delay).

Since I won't be renting a car, this to me seems a potential plus for making Southampton a base; as a significantly better hub for day trips. I realize this is more something I need to figure out for myself: is it more important to wake up and sleep somewhere more charming but with more tiring day trips or more important to wake up somewhere more bland with fewer attractions but with easier travel times to lovely day trip locations? But maybe there are options out of Winchester that I should investigate other than National Rail?

janisj

OK - here I thought we had you convinced Southampton is a pit - and now you are back to considering staying there.

In your OP you said you were looking for a stopover for "a night or more" before heading into London. Now it sounds like you are looking for a place to stay for several nights to do multiple day trips.

Whichever it is (one night or several) - I would not stay in Southampton. If you want to visit Bath - stay in Bath. If you want to visit Salisbury - stay in Salisbury, Winchester? Brighton? Same-o.

Daniel_Williams

OK long and short is I arrive in Southampton and I'd be leaving from SH by boat 12 days later. Truth is initially I really wasn't considering SH except as a potential crashing point for the first day or two (and maybe last) until I began to think further on the sum total of the 12 days and how to get the most of my time. So, my plan was 6 days in London and vicinity (friends, family have offered places to stay) and 6 days elsewhere; I thought to keep things manageable I'd place my focus on Southern England (so much to do there anyway, it's tough to prioritize).

As a traveller, I tend to prefer the idea of a BASE, as one gets to know for example the owners a little better in a B&B/inn (my preference) for example, and one's not always packing and unpacking one's suitcase (nice to feel grounded). Also I find using a base puts a needed dose of humanity into one's trip, rather than running around anonymously from place to place.

The more I think about it, the better Southampton looks given my preferred modus operandi and the fact that I land and depart from there. Let's say I did 3 days SH, 6 days London, 3 days SH. From SH, I could do day trips to Winchester (1 day), Salisbury (1 day), Bath (1 day), Brighton (1 day), Isle of Wight (1 day) to name five, for example. My days by and large would be spent seeing the pretty stuff, I'd just wake, breakfast and sleep in SH (maybe spend a few hours one day exploring SH itself).

Please don't think I've ignored your advice and Winchester I like the idea of more from a point of view of its "charming" factor as a base. I really was leaning 90% toward Winchester for the first 3 days (and couldn't quite figure out what to do for the last 3) after reading your advice until I looked at National Rail's website and Winchester truly seems not as good as SH as a base for day tripping. Now I'm back to waffling .

Understand, I'm undecided as yet and just thinking out loud here.

janisj

&quot;<i>I'm undecided as yet and just thinking out loud here.</i>&quot; fine - just quit thinking about Southampton

I almost always stay in one place several days at a time and use it as a base for touring around. I hate 1 night/1 night/1 night trips. But I would <u>never</u> choose Southampton as my base.

For what you want - Why not consider staying in Bath a few days? It is a great place to visit - but has the major plus of being a tourist hub so you can take trains or tours to lots of other places.

Then a couple of days in Winchester or Salisbury. Or farther afield - Oxford and/or Exeter would be good stopovers for a couple of days.

OR - (now I'm going to really confuse things) - how about Lymington? You could do day trips in the New Forest, over to the Isle of Wight, and to Beaulieu/Buckler's Hard. Lymington would be a great place to stay for 3 days.

willit

If you are looking for a hub for day trips rather than destination, then Southampton does make more sense (but by the same logic, Clapham Junction works).

Depending on your interests you would be spoilt for choice for daytrips.

flanneruk

&quot;But maybe there are options out of Winchester that I should investigate other than National Rail? &quot;

There aren't. Except driving.

Winchester has direct northbound trains to London and to Reading/Oxford/Birmingham. Southbound to Southampton/Bournemouth/Dorchester/Weymouth. That's it: practically no long distance bus service. Delays are a risk, but there's always another train in 30 or 60 minutes: the worst that can happen is you'll spend longer at Southampton or Reading stations than you want to. The risk is highest on the Cross Country services to and (especially) from Reading/Oxford/Birmingham: the South West trains seem prone only to short delays, whereas Cross Country actually cancel and are often badly overcrowded.

The strategy for connections in this area is always to plan as if your train will be cancelled. Then organise your time assuming you'll be on the following one.

willit

Just to add Portsmouth to the list of direct links from Winchester. Ugly city, but has some very interesting parts if you like military history. The Historic dockyard is well worth a visit, even if only to see HMS Victory or the Mary Rose.

On the railway between Portsmouth and Southampton is Portchester - One of my favourite castles. It is not a pretty castle/family home like Windsor/Arundal or Carisbrooke on the Isle of White, but a slab sided keep surrounded by a Roman wall. The Audio tour is worth doing.

vetralla

We did the same thing for the l night pre cruise in Southampton : checked out the Bargate market held Sat. mornings and had great Italian pastries,then wandered through the gardens and old city walls with quaint timbered houses where Jane Austen once lived.
On the train ride down from Gatwick airport we saw Arundel castle in the distance and promise to return to see the area better, including New Forest.
There are three inexpensive hotels grouped together near the port entrance and train station: ETAP, Accord and even a McDonalds drive in. OK for l night but pretty squalid and basic.
There is a pretty good semi-English pub with Guinness and food near the huge Leisureworld complex too.
In the Rome-Civitavecchia port area there is so much but you have to do your homework before, lots of info on elegant etruria web site.

Daniel_Williams

Boy, this round of advice has truly been Fodor's Forums at its best. Thanks vetralla and special thanks to janisj, willit, flanneruk who took the time to give multiple inputs with different perspectives.

I'll tell you there's a battle going on in my head: better-hub vs. way-more-charming...the jury has awhile to deliberate though...

Sincerely DAN

Nonconformist

Another possibility might be Romsey, which you can get to easily from Southampton by bus or train (although the range of cheap accommodation is obviously less). But as a centre there's an easy bus to Winchester; bus or train to Salisbury; train to Portsmouth; train to Bath (though quite long for a daytrip); etc.

Daniel_Williams

Thanks for the extra thoughts, nonconformist.

As for me, I'm leaning more toward the idea of Winchester again as a six-day base after about a week of leaning toward Southampton , but it's good to have other options to consider. Southampton in the end almost seems *too good* of a hub, I was having trouble deciding where I wanted to go: Winchester, Brighton, Chichester, Isle of Wight, Lymington and the New Forest, Salisbury, Bath, Portsmouth, Oxford, Lyme Regis... even sticking to that corner of England as a plan, I felt overwhelmed, knowing that 6 days will fly by.

So I thought to simplify things, to help me decide what to do, why not stay in the less-options but more charming hub Winchester, taking only one long day trip with connections (Bath) and stick to the close-in regional highlights (Salisbury, Lymington, Isle of Wight, perhaps Oxford instead of Brighton) as day trips? In a way, *having* fewer easy day-trip options would help organize my thoughts .

My general thoughts now would be to book one of the more centrally-located inns/B&amp;Bs that are within not-unreasonable (let's say 20 min.) walking distance of Winchester Cathedral (I've seen some on www.visitwinchester.co.uk that appeal like St. John's Croft or perhaps Wykeham Arms). If the more affordably-priced places (under 70 pound a night let's arbitrarily say) are all booked, I will then probably check out Southampton. Luckily my trip would only be July 2009, so I have awhile to hammer out details.

Thanks again for all thoughts. DAN

Cholmondley_Warner

Re the Wykeham Arms accomodation. There is accomodation in the pub and they also have an annexe (a house over the road). The rooms in the pub are much better. Plus, of course, they are in a pub.

Daniel_Williams

Thanks again,

I wanted to report back that I've booked 5 nights in Southampton, a B&B in the Polygon area not far from the train station (but within walking distance to the water) for convenience for day trips. (The other 7 nights of my trip will be based out of London at a cousin's place in Hampstead.) The appeal of a convenient hub was too great, bland though it might be... but I'll be sure to post a trip report to let all know if I regretted my choice of action . Hey, if the University of Southampton students (some actually seem to like the town there from what I've read) can survive several years there, I figured I should be able to manage 5 days. Anyhow, I'm thankful for all the "don't-do-it"s, as my expectations will be suitably low (only room to be positively surprised LOL).

From Southampton, my plan is to day trip to Bath, Salisbury, Winchester and Isle of Wight on different days; first day, I'll just probably be settling in and exploring my immediate surroundings in Southampton, go to the center, check out the Common (maybe take the ferry to Hythe if it's recommended). If anyone has a specific recommendation of restaurants located centrally within Southampton: I'm especially interested in seafood, vegetarian, healthy-options, traditional English pub, ideally on the inexpensive side... but really I'm open to multiple food recommendations. Ultimately I want your opinion; if it's an establishment you enjoy, I'll put in on my list.

Best wishes to all,

Daniel

willit

The White Star in Oxford street is a good "Gastropub". I have eaten there a couple of times, and the food is good, but some have complained that the portions are a little small.

Oxford street is a good location for pubs and restaurants - walkable from the polygon area. Kutis is a very good Indian restaurant - they do a normal (Extensive) menu, but also have an excellent buffet upstairs.

The Cowherds on the common is in an excellent location, the food is OK.

Daniel_Williams

Thanks willit ever so much for the pub and other restaurant suggestions. I was hoping you'd respond here, remembering how helpful you were with my original query and that you work in Southampton.

I enjoy good Indian food, so suggestion of Kutis is especially appreciated (I hear P.O.S.H is good, but on the expensive side). Looks like Oxford Street restaurant area on Mapquest is about a 15-minute walk or so... perfect!

Anyhow, I am truly grateful for all the advice given.

Sincerely,

Daniel