Shan85

I would love some opinions please. Trip will be my 20 yo son and myself, first two weeks of May 2025. This will only be our 2nd trip to Europe, and I won't lie, the train systems intimidate me a bit! We live in a small rural town, so subways and busses are not even something we are familiar with!Definitely plan on learning up as much as possible and luckily have plenty of time to do that before the trip! Trying to nail down itinerary enough to have dates/ get flights booked before flight prices increase. Mainly looking for opinions on if this itinerary is feasible..

-Fly into Zurich- likely stay one night due to the 20 hr travel day and 12 hr time difference we will be exhausted.
-Train to Lauterbrunnen. Stay 3 nights so we have a full 2 days- this is really the highlight of our trip! Lauterbrunnen and its surrounding villages have been high on my bucketlist for many years. points of interest are Gimmelwald, Grindelwald/first cliff walk, Wengen- walk trail from Mannlichen to Klein Scheidegg, jungfraujoch.
- train to Lucerne- one night? - interested in lake boat tour, lion monument, Mt. Pilatus lookout, however may be a bit out if the way/too time consuming for the short amount of time here. NOTE: Lucerne is not a *must do* on our list and would likely be something I'd be open to cutting entirely if need be. Thoughts?
- Train to Castle Neuschwanstein- this is where things get tricky! It seems we will need to change trains quite a few times and it's a bit out of the way, but we would really like to see the castle if possible! Would also visit hohenschwangau castle at this stop. Is it advised to stay one night in Fussen here prior, to get up and be one if the first in line for admittance to the castles? Spend a half day exploring the two castles and eat lunch before heading to our next location?
- Train to Salzburg- stay 3 nights. Salzburg is high on our list! Interest points: Mozart museum, Mirabell Gardens, St. Peter's cemetery and church, Marble Hall Orchestra concert, Augustiner brewhouse... I would love to see a few Sound if Music sites, like Schloss Leopoldskron Hotel (Von Trappe home) and Julie's Hill...I would also love to take a day trip to Hallstat!! But that would eat up one entire day of our two full days in Salzburg, so that is still undecided!
- train to Munich, stay at least 2 nights- Dachau Concentration Camp memorial site as well as multiple sites around the city (I have a long list that I will need to narrow down!)
- Fly home from Munich

Current itinerary puts us at 11 nights in destination. This has us covering quite a bit of ground, however we don't make it to Europe often and likely will nit be back to this area, so trying to get in all the must she's into one trip! What would you add or cut out of this itinerary? Would it be more feasible to pick up a car rental in Munich and drive to Salzburg in order to make the castle stops less complicated? Or would that complicate things more? I definitely wouldn't want a car for the rest of the trip as the other destinations are either cities or mountain towns, both if which are more complicated with a vehicle.
Where in the world do I start with looking at train routes and train tickets? 😵‍💫 Will I need to buy tickets from multiple sites as we'll be crossing borders, or can this all be done on the same site? It seems there are so many sites that sell train tickets! I think this is the main thing I need guidance on, but would love to hear thoughts and suggestions otherwise!
Also this itinerary can be flipped and done backwards if it would make more sense to do so. Both Munich and Zurich have great flights for us and are pricing the same either way we do it, so totally open to starting in Munich, ending in Zurich as well!

kja

First and foremost -- take a deep breath! You will have a wonderfully memorable trip.

I can't answer all your questions, but can offer some bits of potentially useful information:

For train information in general, consult the excellent seat61.com: https://www.seat61.com/
Then for train and other public transportation in Switzerland, sbb: https://www.sbb.ch/en
For how to get from place to place, rome2rio.com -- be sure to click through to the underlying sites. https://www.rome2rio.com/
Trains in Europe -- and IME, particularly those in this part of Europe -- are comfortable and convenient. I love train travel! You need to be prepared to get off rather quickly once you reach your destinations, but you'll hear timely announcement in various language, including English.

I'm no expert, but my understanding from those who are is that May is NOT a good time to go into the Bernese Oberland. Sorry about that! By all means, gather further information ... but you might do well to consider some other parts of Switzerland if you are committed to a trip in early May or consider shifting your travel to later in the year (June through Oct.) if you can.

I think you would be wise to trim your wish list for this trip a bit, though I think you can fit a lot in (not all of it) if you are prepared for a fast-paced experience and plan well. Do make sure you pay careful attention to actual transit times (and the time needed to check in/out of hotels, reach train / bus stations, etc.) to confirm that you really would have the time you want in each location. FWIW, i haven't been to Neuschwanstein, but loved Salzburg and thought 3 days there reasonable and I thoroughly enjoyed Lauterbrunnen, where I wanted 3 days. (I was there in June.) I also enjoy Lucerne, though it gets so many tourists these days that it can feel a bit overrun at times. I like Zurich, but it seems a low priority for you. As for Munich, I'm glad I had several days there. Two nights there would really give you only a day or so, and I'm sure you can appreciate that Dachau will be an emotional experience. Many of us want to plan nothing other than a walk in a park and a nice dinner after visiting a concentration camp, so you might not be allowing any time for Munich's gems.

IMO, one of the most difficult elements of travel is deterimining what constitutes "getting the most of one's trip." For some, it means seeing little bits of many placers; for others, it means seeing a few places more intensely. No right or wrong answers, although I would say that for me, any trip that means spending more time in relocation than in seeing places is out of balance unless the purpose of the trip is to experience the transportation itself. (EG, taking the Orient Express.) I always start with too long a wish list and I find every "cut" painful, but know that for me, I'll end up enjoying my trip more if I make sure I have the time I want in the places I do visit. YMMV.

Hope that helps!

Shan85

Kja, thank you, yes that is helpful! I'm really glad that you brought up the timing. I have been researching if May is a good time to visit Lauterbrunnen, and have been getting great feedback- completely missing the fact that conditions could be completely different up the Bernese! Although we aren't avid hikers, and won't be on all the trails, we absolutely plan to head up the cable cars for those breathtaking views, and as mentioned, I would really love to walk the trail between Klein Scheidegg and Mannlichen! I will consider looking at dates in June- from what I've gathered from other posts it seems mid/late June is a good time to make sure things are mostly open.
I have considered skipping the castles as well as Lucerne. It does seem like quite a bit more work for the detour to the castles. I definitely want to spend at least two full days in each of the three main destinations, if not three (Lauterbrunnen, Salzburg, Munich)... lots to figure out, hoping a few others will chime in here with their thoughts!

Nautiker

cheers shan,

trains can look intimidating at first glance, but you don't need a lot of practice to enjoy them - and Switzerland, Austria and Germany are likely the perfect 'beginner-countries' to start with this mode of transport.

you will probably have heard of 'rail passes / Eurail passes' - and while I usually no longer recommend them, in your situation they might actually pay off. these passes will give you great flexibility and will reduce the bother of needing different outlets/brokers to buy different tickets, all for an adequate price. a more experienced rail user might prefer a mix of discounted super-saver fares and cheap local offers - well, we can look into that, too, but given the relatively few trips you on your plan, this would not necessarily & decisively reduce your costs. starting point re: rail passes would be www.eurail.com

some basics: the network in the area you are looking into is very dense (Switzerland: https://www.swissrailways.com/assets...ss_2024_EN.pdf , Bavaria (incl Salzburg): https://www.mvg.de/dam/jcre41cb75-e77c-489c-b8c9-429b0111fc02/Bahnland-Bayern-Liniennetzplan.pdf , Austria: https://infrastruktur.oebb.at/de/ges...-oebb-netz.pdf).

you can expect trains at least hourly on the mainlines and most branchlines, too, from early morning until late in the evening. train stations are well connected to all other urban transport, most larger stations offer a variety of services (shops, snacks, luggage lockers etc), just like an airport would do. there are no security screenings and most trains you just board and take any free seat. it is literally ok to get to a station just a few minutes before your train departs, platforms will be displayed in the main hall. for some trains you can make an optional seat reservation, but for most it will not be necessary.

long-distance trains might have a dining-car, however you are free to bring your own snacks and beverages. 2nd class is fine. there are not really any luggage restrictions. all staff will have at least basic English skills, if not, there will always be someone nearby to help out with translating. when entering Germany, your passports will likely be checked.

in case you use a timetable search like the Swiss sbb.ch or the German bahn.de (both have an English language option), note that all connections displayed are considered doable, even if it's just a few minutes. at bahn.de you can switch the settings to allow more time for transfers, not sure about sbb.ch. if a train is running late and you miss your connection, you are entitled to just hop on the next one. seat61.com is indeed an excellent resource to learn more about train travel. new timetables for 2025 will be published around mid/end-October.

other topics: I am not aware of the Alps being difficult weather-wise in May, but then I could be mistaken, I really do not know (spring time over at my place in western Germany in recent years has been so very volatile that I would no longer dare to make general assumptions at all). now, _if_ Lauterbrunnen is meant to be a highlight of your trip, I dare to make a suggestion: don't do an open-jaw flight, instead book a round-trip to Zürich and stay flexible. yes, it means backtracking to your point of entry (time, cost, bother), something I would usually advise against, however most of those places on your itinerary have an abundance of accomodation that can mostly be booked at an instant online, there are no noteworthy school/public holidays in early May to take into account, you could verbatim decide upon arrival whether you deem the weather in Lauterbrunn suitable at that moment or rather give it a shot one week later. however I am aware that nowadays lots of people prefer to have everything sorted out right from the start. and of course it's differrent in case you have a specific accomodation in mind...

last note, sorry, it's a pet peeve of mine: don't forget that Neuschwanstein castle isn't but just a folly of a minor local aristocrat. it has no great historical or architectural value. it's eye candy, enjoy it - nothing less, nothing more...

note that both Salzburg and Neuschwanstein could be doable as daytrips from Munich, however with travel times of roughly 1,5-2hrs/direction, probably not a desirable thing to do...

kja

It's not the Alps in general -- it's the Bernese Oberland in particular that iI believe to be precarious in April and (early) May. Look at post # 4 from Ingo, an expert on Switzerland, in this thread: Best Base: Berner Oberland But perhaps I've misunderstood....

fourfortravel

"Salzburg- stay 3 nights. Salzburg is high on our list! Interest points: Mozart museum, Mirabell Gardens, St. Peter's cemetery and church, Marble Hall Orchestra concert, Augustiner brewhouse... I would love to see a few Sound if Music sites, like Schloss Leopoldskron Hotel (Von Trappe home) and Julie's Hill...I would also love to take a day trip to Hallstat!! But that would eat up one entire day of our two full days in Salzburg, so that is still undecided!"

(My cred. We lived in Vienna for 7 years and helped many friends and family with their Salzburg dreams.)

1. Skip Hallstatt. The small town hates day-trippers, rightly so. The city built a fence to stop the incessant influencers and selfie-snots from clogging up the "iconic view" for their vanity projects. The town is at its best when the day-trippers depart. Plus, you'll need both days in Salzburg.

2. There are several half-day tours of the famous Sound of Music sights you might investigate. Several are not easily accessible on public transportation (like Schloss Leopoldskron; its breakfast room inspired the ballroom scene in the movie but I believe is only accessible to paying guests.) Also, you can not tour the hillside where Maria twirled --it's private property, though you can twirl about in your rented Dirndl on similar hills.) Some of the tours also go to the basilica in Mondsee where the Captain and Maria were married.

wildiowa

I am by no means an expert, but we did a very similar trip recently. We are older and also from rural US. The trains are so excellent. Put the SBB app on your phone and use it. Wow. Once you get in the groove it's a snap and trains are precise and plentiful. Travel passes are needed to save $$$ but for many, confusing. If you buy a flex or travel pass you need to plan and maximize your daily use to get full value, or a half price card or other option may be better. Look here for advice but it can get overwhelming for a rookie, like me. We went with an 8 day Swiss flex pass but we went on two or even three trips on trains ferries lifts etc. a day. Pretty expensive but convenient. If you can afford it go first class.

Even though you want to max your experience try not to jump from town to town. Packing up getting to the train checking in and out finding the next hotel unpacking...it just burns up your time and you are worn out and crabby. Lauterbrunnen we stayed at the Silberhorn...great food and hotel. Good base for the mountains and hikes and cable cars...your pass will not work past certain points going to Matterhorn and other high mountain sites so be prepared to spend more $$ on rail or cog trains..in some cases, a lot more $$$. Not sure of climate in May. Overall we try to avoid cities and don't need to see more cathedrals old castles etc...if we have time, ok, but see one you've seen them all. Base several days somewhere strategic, take day trips and get out where things are real, don't try to squeeze everything in one trip. Trying to stuff 10 pounds in a five-pound bag! Again, no expert...but this is what have found in our travels...the trains are so cool, you will be amazed. Good luck.