gocats2002

djkbooks, Not that zanie needs anyone rushing to his defense, but zanie has discussed cost of living. In fact, it is one of his major concerns!
I find this interesting from a US travel perspective. It's fun to read of people's takes on cities and towns across the US. Also, I'm finding zanie's writing style makes me smile. It is zany, indeed, and the perspective is refreshing, somehow.
So, directly travel related or not, I'm thoroughly enjoying this thread!

puddin

I concur with gocats. Zanie, you rule, brother/sister/whichever you are... Keep us updated as to your progress. Have you ever thought of going to journalism school?

ChristieP

Actually, the techie boom in Austin is pretty much over. The dot.coms have become extinct, and growth in that sector has slowed tremendously. Yes, this higher unemployment has made the competition for jobs a little tougher, too.

You might want to consider smaller towns in the Texas Hill Country, such as Hunt, Wimberly, and Fredricksburg. All of them have many opportunities for creative people.

Jacksen

Zanie,

For cost of living and number/variety of jobs, Philadelphia is something to seriously consider. In fact, they were mentioning on the news that Philadlephia is a relative bargain as far as big cities are concerned, and that real estate in Philly has a good outlook as far as appreciation.

The public transportation system (SEPTA, PATCO, New Jersey Transit, and Amtrak) is excellent. Philly has a lot of culture and great restaurants and New York City is a 90 minute train ride from there.

In terms of the climate, winters are not too bad although, it does snow, it's nothing like Buffalo or Rochester, NY. The summers can be humid at times, but people spend time in air conditioned places most of the time duringf the day anyway.

Good luck with your decision.

zanie

Hi Gang!

GoCats2002, you made reference in your post, apparently to another post by someone known as "djkbooks". I have not seen this post or reply or whatever as I was away from the board for a day or so. Reading between the lines, I'm gathering that someone has objected to the posting of relocation subjects as opposed to vacation-related subjects. To me, it is all travel-related and someone contemplating a vacation might gain a unique perspective from a thread about relocation and vice-versa. "Cain't we all just git along?"

GoCats2002 and Puddin, thank you for your compliments on my writing. Actually, writing is the art to which I referred in alluding to my creative endeavors and passions. Puddin, I would probably have chosen journalism as a career but had a very bad experience with a journalism teacher early in my education. That experience soured my outlook on that profession and I let it sidetrack me elsewhere. My primary interest is fiction writing though I'm capable in multiple genres. I'm looking for a work situation that allows me to devote at least some time and creative energy to my fiction writing career and hoping that a move may help me accomplish that.

At this point, I would love to be able to go back to school but that is just not possible, given my current situation. If I did go back to school, it would be to become a clinical counseling psychologist, (another of my passions). Counseling is something that comes very naturally to me and my acquaintances, co-workers, and even complete strangers come to me for advice. Now, if only I could sort out my own life! LOL!

ChristieP, thank you for the heads-ups regarding the decline of the tech sector in Austin. I had been aware of this trend in the economy at large, but assumed it was temporary.

The Texas Hill Country is nice and I had considered this area, including San Marcos and New Braunfels, when thinking about living in a smaller town and commuting to a larger, nearby city for work and entertainment. Now you've got me curious! What sort of opportunities are there for creative people there?

With regard to Wimberly in particular, I have noticed that it seems to have an untra-conservative reputation. I visited a website which allows you to specify your tastes and needs with regard to several different types of criteria. Then, based on your answers to their quetionnaire, they present you with a list of places that match your interests. I have trained myself to consider every possible angle and perspective so I experimented by taking the test again later, and choosing the opposite of what I want in a place to live, adjusting the criteria periodically to isolate specific criteria. This approach lets me know which areas to avoid and provides some perspective by contrast. Anyway, Wimberly consistently showed up on this "opposite of what I want list" and various permutations of that list. So, I'm a little reluctant to consider living there.

Jacksen, thank you for hanging in there and providing me with a more well-rounded view of Philadelphia. There are a lot of things I do like about it. I've never been there, mind you but I perceive it to have a noir atmosphere, which I like, (to illustrate my point, the actual current front runner on my list is New Orleans, despite what I've heard is a horrible job situation). Very Scorpio! Er,.. for those of you who are into astrology.

One of the things I do like about Philadelphia and the area is the close proximity to other population centers, good public transportation, and a cosmopolitan energy. I haven't studied Philadelphia as closely as some of my other candidates and don't know where it might stand concerning pollution but a quick mental review of my criteria makes me think that I should probably give it more serious consideration. The only criteria I can't think of right away, where it seems to totally "miss the boat" is climate.

Thank you all for your input, encouraging comments and well-wishes! Any additional info and insights is very welcome! My window of opportunity is small and I need to act soon. Your feedback is of the utmost importance! Thank you all again!

zanie

axelrod6

The answer to your prayers is Ashville, North Carolina - moderate climate, lots of creative people - many in unconventional jobs, and a reasonable cost of living. You are unlikely to get rich there, but that does not sound like your goal. Check it out!

By the by, my son just graduated from college and went to San Diego to find a job because he wants to live in San Diego. No contacts. He has had a bear of a time finding work, and has been lucky to find a fairly low-level sales job after looking for 2 months. But you can find reasonably low-cost housing if you are not housing a family (he is sharing an apartment), and the weather is great.

But I still recommend Ashville, from what I've heard from happy residents.

axelrod6

Sorry - that is Asheville - I misspelled it.

zanie

Hi Axelrod6,

Thank you for the info re: Asheville! Asheville is another place I'd given strong consideration to but wound up having to eliminate in the next to last round.

I do like the size, (ease of commuting), respect for people who are different, the vibrancy of the metaphysical community there, and the beautiful scenery, all in addition to the postitive factors you've mentioned already.

Yes, you are correct that getting rich, at least in a conventional job is not my goal. I do believe that I might eventually realize a better than average income from my writing but it would take years to develop and in the meantime, I would like to live in a place I could enjoy, which would provide adequate employment of a type that does not diminish my creative energies.

The reason I eliminated Asheville from my list of finalists is the same as with many otherwise promising places we've discussed here; I just don't see how there would be enough jobs. Please tell me if I'm wrong about that. I do realize that jobs are hard to find everywhere now, even in the largest of cities.

As much as this has come up, I should probably elaborate briefly on the reason that plenty of jobs is such an important consideration for me. While I don't have superlative educational credentials, I have always been skilled at getting jobs. The problem has been keeping them. I know that makes me sound like a bit of a flake but hear me out and you may begin to understand my point of view.

I have lots of ability in a business environment and have held very responsible positions in retail management and sales management, successfully managing as many as 60 employees at a time. The problem is that I have a very low tolerance for the petty competitiveness and back-biting that pervades the typical workplace. Usually, this has no bearing on how well you are doing your job. In fact, I have often noticed a direct correlation between the personal attacks directed at me and a positive job performance. Also, my experience has been that business owners want results but simply don't want to commit the resources and focus, (even very limited resources), necessary to accomplish their goals. I too often find myself caring more about the business than the owner/upper management and that, my friends is a very tough row to hoe!

Bottom-line my passion is not for the mundane world of business anyway. I could give a rodent's posterior for the fact that my company sold one more widget this year than last. Yes, I do know that others have experienced the same feelings, it's just that I can't ignore mine and they haven't diminished over time. I actually find myself inadvertantly doing things to sabotage my own efforts in these types of jobs.

Now, as a result of the parameters outlined above, I have done and will continue to do a lot of job-hopping in order to eek out a minimal survival, while trying to write. As you can imagine, that requires lots of available jobs!

I would love to find an interesting job, (and I know they are out there), which would allow me to remain long-term and have some sense of dignity and passion but most that I'm aware of require further education. Frankly, if I could find a job digging ditches right now which would pay enough to cover my most basic expenses and not involve office politics, I would jump at it but the reality is that these types of situations are few and far between.

I apologize for burdening you all with my personal junk but as I mentioned in an earlier reply on this thread, we are all; every one of us, challenged in some area of our lives. All you have to do is watch the 6p.m. news to realize that what you do impacts the lives of others.

Thank you for all the supportive encouragement and replies! Hopefully, there will be still more. Cheers!

zanie

obxgirl

The petty competitiveness and back-biting that pervades the typical workplace is a function of human nature and is a feature of any workforce exceeding one person. And how you act, react or manage that fact has a direct bearing on your success in the workplace. Sad but true. Truer than true in retail.

You sound like a perfect candidate for an independent contractor. Opportunities for this are going to abound more in large metro areas than small towns. Either that or start your own retain business and call the shots on inter-employee behavior.

Atlanta? Orlando? Phoenix?

enjoylife

I live in Los Angeles. The problem is the cost of living is high and the jobs are not plentiful. There has been a large surge of movement of folks from Los Angeles to Las Vegas. Housing is affordable. No personal income tax. Plenty of jobs.

Flyboy

If you are willing to put aside your aversion to cold winters, two places I would recommend considering are:

1. Minneapolis-St. Paul
2. Madison, Wisconsin

Both tend to have a lot of diverse job opportunities and a steady in-migration of creative types. (Madison is not a LARGE city, but it is a very vibrant and stimulating place, nonetheless.) Ruling out northern climes will take a lot of great places off the table that would otherwise fulfill many of your needs.

SydneyLA

Zanie, I have lived in Los Angeles for 8 years now. I am not a fan of the city or the area for many reasons which I will not post for fear of starting a war, which I do not want to do.

However, the positive qualities of Los Angeles are the sheer number and diversity of jobs here. There are many industries based here, and what is nice about Los Angeles is how many creative industries there are. The entertainment sector obviously dominates, and it attracts a diverse, driven, creative group of people from around the world.

With this comes an open, accepting population that you may not find in many other cities. This is what I definitely enjoy most about life in LA.

Entertainment gets most of the attention, but there are so many industries based here that add to the diversity of good jobs.

Obviously there are some serious quality of life issues that come with this. With regards to traffic, if you live near your job you won't have to deal with the daily stress of the commute. I work in Downtown LA and commute by the Red Line from Hollywood, which is wonderful...20 minutes to relax and read the paper on my way to work. My point is that if you don't choose to live 40 miles from your work, you can avoid some of the pain of living here.

Any more specifics about QOL, feel free to e-mail me.

mercedes355

I vote for Houston. Okay, so it's not what you would consider liberal. But you are right, Zanie, about the Montrose area being more diverse.

There are a lot of artsy, unique people who live in the Montrose/ Heights area. Cost of living in Houston is cheap compared to the rest of the country. And if you move in one of the high rises, it's like living in a community.

I have some friends that live in the Executive House (a high rise on W. Alabama right off Montrose), and within two months of living there they seemed to know everyone in the area.

There are a lot of different job choices in Houston, but, of course, the economy is bad everywhere right now. If you need any more info, let me know

zanie

Hi Everyone! And thank you for the continuing thoughtful replies!

Obxgirl, you've really hit the nail on the head with regard to office politics in all its forms being an inextricable part of human nature.

I've tried long enough to know that I'm not going to change my attitudes towards it, nor will I be able to change the attitudes of those who choose to practice it.

Unfortunately, much of success in business is about dominating other people. While I can't tolerate being dominated, I really don't get my jollies dominating anyone else either. I agree that the role of "independent contractor" would suit me best but that sort of position, at least, in terms of one that would support me, is currently beyond my grasp, hence my intense frustration.

Of your recommendation of cities, Phoenix is still on the table. Atlanta has many of the same problems of other large cities and while it may be progressive for its immediate region, it is not as much so in the national context. Orlando has many good points and Florida in general, contains three of my top finalists. If I did relocate to Florida, Orlando would not be my choice, though some of the cities along the East Coast of Florida and within an hour or less of Orlando did score extremely high on my list of practical criteria. Thank you for your input.

Enjoylife, thank you for the info on Los Angeles, which is still very much in the running among my finalists! In an abstract sense I can conceive of the idea that such a large population base with such diversity of industry could be a place where jobs are hard to come by on a long-term basis but I just have a hard time understanding it in a practical sense. The same applies to my thinking on San Francisco. Accepting that the job picture is that bad in either of these places, surely it is still better than most other cities.

Las Vegas really has a lot going for it and it draws me like a moth to a flame, for entertainment purposes. On the other hand, I understand that the traffic is horrendous and getting worse and that jobs are limited primarily to the entertainment industry.

Flyboy, thank you for keeping my perspective fresh with the positive attributes of some of the northern cities. I've heard a lot of good things about Minneapolis-St. Paul and Madison and they certainly do have a reputation for being progressive. If I were going to start a list of desirable, (imho), northern cities, I would start with New York City, where the only downside I can see other than the climate, which is still relatively mild, is the highest cost of living in the U.S., (San Francisco may now own this dubious honor). Here again, Minneapolis-St. Paul and Madison seem to rank about upper middle range among my candidates. There are just too many other places that score higher in reference to all my criteria.

SydneyLA, all I can say is, "You practically read my mind!!! I had been hoping to hear from a long-time resident of LA and in particular, someone with a perspective on Downtown LA, which received a very favorable review in the book, "Funky Towns, U.S.A."

While I do want to know the dirty, low-down, as well as the good, I respect and admire your desire to avoid a board war, which would be counter-productive the the sharing of knowledge here.

My most grave concerns are for traffic, pollution, and cost of living. I had been meaning to specifically ask about public transportation in LA but kept forgetting in the heat of posting. Thank you for reading between the lines of my previous posts and anticipating the importance of this issue.

I will definitely be e-mailing you for more in-depth info on LA but please bear with me if it takes a day for me to get to it.

Mercedes355, I have seen your posts in the past and had been meaning to ask you about Houston but somehow just never got around to it. I'm so glad you responded to my post and really appreciate your insights into life in Houston and the Montrose area! in particular. It does sound somewhat promising based on the info you've provided and some of the info I'd read elsewhere.

Your post is very timely as I have boiled down my concerns about Houston to one very crucial question; "If I lived in the Montrose area, would there be a high enough concentration of jobs in reasonably close proximity, (a few miles or so), to eliminate the need to get on the interstates and fight the horrendous traffic?"

A move to Houston would be much easier on me financially than all of the other places we've discussed here, except maybe San Antonio, so I'm very interested in your opinions!

Thank you all again!

zanie

sightseer

If you're considering LA as an option, you might want to join the discussion forum on the newdowntown.com website. It's a fairly active forum all geared around the downtown LA lifestyle. You might enjoy a loft in the Artist's district or in the historic district (a growing rental loft market).

mercedes355

Zanie-

Hi! I'm glad you are considering Houston as a place to live. I think if you lived in the Montrose area, it would be more convienent to take a bus to work. I live in the suburbs so the commute to downtown is hell

But, if you live downtown or close to what is considered "downtown" (Montrose), there would be many work options within a short distance of where you would live. The buses are a lot better than they used to be, and Metro is completing a monorail downtown.

Also, they are still in the process of revitalizing downtown. Even though they are trying to make it more preppy than artsy, they have built some little cafes and coffee houses. And, of course, the more places they open downtown would be more job options for you.

Good luck and let me know if you are curious about anything else.

rjw_lgb_ca

I live in the LA metro area (in Long Beach), 30 miles south of where I work (in Santa Monica). The economy in this area is incredibly diverse, and whether you choose the employee or contractor route, you can find jobs in just about every specialty (my job straddles finance and computer technology). The problem is, there are a LOT of people looking.

You can probably choose to live anywhere and find employment nearby. I am staying put in my career (I'm a principal at my firm) and at home (I'm one of those insane people that loves Long Beach), so I accept my commute as a fact of life. I could probably shorten my commute by pursuing a job in Newport Beach. Or work from home more often (technology will allow me to do this).

Climate? Practically perfect. If you're really intent on avoiding extremes, focus your home hunt in coastal areas.

The high cost of living in this area boils down to this: People want to live here. They even want to live in gritty ol' Long Beach; my condo has more than tripled in market value in the last five years. Fact is, if you want to live somewhere, you'll find the means to live there. And I haven't ever used an air conditioner since I moved to Long Beach (I couldn't say that if I lived in Texas).

MightyIsis

Zanie -- what a thought provoking thread - please keep us posted on where you go and your artistic goals. We're rooting for you.

Back-biting can happen in the Brooks Brothers corporate world, but it can also happen in the laid back creative world, the non-profit, public service world, anywhere there are people, really. (working with animals may be a solution, no?)

One area that hasn't been mentioned yet is Chapel Hill, NC. Yes, it's in the south, but it's still the most liberal town between DC and Key West. Chapel Hill is one of 3 cities (Raleigh, Durham, and CH) in the area. I think it's known as Research Triangle Park. Should be a vibrant enough economy for you to pay the bills. Colleges, state govt., pharmaceuticals, tech, finance, hotels, restaurants, construction, you name it. Weather-wise it's probably what you are looking for.

Never been to the west coast, so can't comment on those places. Santa Fe is just as high cost as California. Boulder may be too cold in the winter for your taste. Houston -- GOD's STEAM ROOM! San Antonio, conservative. Austin, not just high tech, they have a thriving music scene. Good luck!

zanie

Hi All!

Wow! The great info continues to pour in! Thank you all so much!

Sightseer, thank you for the info about the Downtown L.A. lifestyle discussion forum. It sounds extremely interesting! Re: the lofts you mention and other housing in downtown, would it be significantly less expensive than other areas or more expensive due to its rising status as a hip and trendy place to be?

Mercedes355, thank you for the critical info about jobs, commuting and living in Montrose/Downtown Houston. While getting settled in and finding one of those more desirable job types, I expect to perhaps, work two or three substandard jobs in order to make ends meet. Therefore, I would not only need to be able to commute to and from but rather to and from twice in a day. Would the busses you mentioned be necessary or could I walk to a substantial number of jobs in the Montrose/Downtown/University Park/River Oaks area? I've seen a map but the part I can't determine from the map is scale. I'm guessing that there would be lots of jobs in these combined areas butI'm guessing that the miles involved would preclude traveling by foot.

If I used my car, stuck to the side streets, confined my commute to the area I just outlined, and avoided the major highways, is traffic still likely going to result in a commute time of more than 30 minutes?

With the revitalization of the downtown area, do you suppose the growth in jobs will be mainly in the service industry or will there be more businesses locating and/or expanding?

What does the future of Montrose appear to be? I'm sure lots of conservatives would love to see it disappear and with the revitalization of downtown being more preppy than artsy, will Downtown draw enough money away from Montrose as an entertainment center to jeopardize its thriving existence? Thank you for all your help!

rjw_lgb_ca, Thank you for all the vital info on L.A. Your post goes right to the heart of many of the issues I need to resolve.

Imho, gritty is good up to a point. Like weather, if it consistently gets in the way of your daily activities, then it's a problem. I think Long Beach would be just about right in my estimation. After all, New Orleans currently ties with San Francisco for number 1 on my list.

Your daily commute covers just about the entire scope of the area I'm most interested in, though I would expand further east to include the downtown area. What is your mode of transportation? How long does it take to cover 30 miles at rush hour?

I'm greatly encouraged by your mention of the diversity of the economy in this area and the number of jobs!

As you say, if you really want to live somewhere, you will find a way. I just want to avoid that "way" being in a homeless shelter! LOL!

I prefer to live in the coastal areas anyway for reasons including, but not limited to climate. However, I would expect close proximity to the coast to equate with a still higher cost of living.

MightyIsis, my genuinely heartfelt appreciation to you for your support and encouragement!

I do realize that the base manifestations of human nature do exist in every area of human endeavor. It also occurs to me that I may appear a bit unreasonable in trying to assert my terms in this present incarnation of our society. However, it has gotten to the point where I have no other choice. I can no longer voluntarily suffer without an involuntary reaction physically, mentally, and emotionally. I choose to see this as a positive thing. After all, if Madonna had been able to tolerate being a waitress...well, she might still be one and that would not be the best and highest expression of who she is.

I have been interested in the Raleigh/Chapel Hill/Durham area and would like to know more about it. However, based on what I presently know, I had to table it in the second to last round of eliminations. I know I may be missing out on something great but time is not on my side.

Cheers!

zanie

cnmiranda

Zanie, I was just hoping to clarify some of your thoughts on the LV area. Have lived here for 11 years and enjoy it. Traffic isn't all that bad, compared to other considerations like LAX and CA it's a breeze. Many people (myself included) live in a certain area of town and also work nearby. I only go to the strip when family and friends are it town. Perhaps if you visit again you could take a trip to rural Las Vegas. Most people choose to live in Henderson or the Northwest part of town, about 25 mins from the strip. I think you'll be surprised to see all that Las Vegas has to offer.

Regarding jobs, while tourism is the biggest industry there are many other types of vocations widely spread. The healthcare industry is doing great and well as construction and many corporations have headquarters here, like Citibank. Also teachers are in high demand. There are many specializations in these categories.

The best part of living in Las Vegas for me is that you are only an hour or so flight away from Lax, San Siego, SFO, and Phoenix. Good luck.